What is the use in trying to change the way Greed and power works, we the people can't verify any of the crap the politicians and their media mouthpiece feed us , so I must look behind the mask for answers.
The Repuplic/rebs can use made up Ben Laden tapes, Syrian Nukes tapes to say whatever they need to say in order to steer the masses in any direction they chose for best effect.
The only thing I have to fall back on is Americas past history, Anglo-Saxon Colonial history and who is fighting and in whose country.( Theater's of war)
Is the Syrians leaders debating how to destabilize America ,control its government and it's economy?
Is the North Koreans leaders debating how to destabilize America , control its government and it's economy?
How about Iran, do they have flotilla of Battle Ships in American Waters, troops and plains in Canada, Mexico, Cuba, Nassau while their leaders rally the rest of the Arab and Muslim world in debating on how to destabilize America's government, control of its economy, trade and natural resources, and it's military?
Conclusion …..The bush boys is Extremely Machiavellian in their thinking, words, and deeds, however 70% of the American citizenry are dumb to it 10% are awake to it 20% are in league with it. That 20% is largely Anglo Saxon and Jewish

trisagion, now that i think about it. i believe you did answer my question.

trisagion, i must confess that my education is mostly street based. people on that level do use off colored language, but i find the honesty there is unpretencious and straight from the hip. it is not the color of the language that is important to me, it is the content. i suggest that some of the straight religious bigots that i have met, have no problem dropping to that level. i also have met some with scrubbed- clean language who are not phoney and colorful, and unpretentious. to me, it is not important one way or the other. personally those with a heart, that have compassion, and humanity, are the qualitys that i respect, regardless of their religious beliefs or their sexuality. there are good people or bad people in every walk of life. all that aside, you have yet to answer my question. :) peace. terry.

Hi terryb. Some people feel scrubbed-clean language is inauthentic, phoney, and colorless. May I take it you don't feel that way? I have to confess I find it hard to believe Mary Cheney went about her job as beer saleswoman, making the circuit of the gay bars, without slipping into the native lingo. While I don't doubt her relationship with 'Mr. Leather' was strictly platonic, I just can't see her going into gay bars and saying, 'Golly gee, Coors Beer is peachy keen; the smart set enjoys it:'

"Before she became a public enigma, she used to earn a nice living as a corporate liaison for Coors Brewing Co., going into gay bars (sometimes with Mr. International Leather 1999, who would wear his chaps and straps, according to the Advocate) to convince everyone that Coors had changed...Mary said, here, try a Coors." (Washington Post, 'What Everybody Doesn't Know About Mary Cheney,' October 19, 2004, http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A43375-2004Oct18.html)

Maybe she did, who knows. You know the old saying about what happens when you 'assume'... unfortunately it's slightly off-color so I can't say it!

trisagion, your assumpions about gays, go to my point. i am not gay, but i, as you, probably know some. your other reference " the language used by republicans is such to shock even atheists." so... I assume... as well. if my assumption is wrong, i stand to be corrected.

So If Dick wrote it it would be where the politicians licked the press? "Gotta Scooter?"

I'll bet they are trying to give it away!

TrisagionSeraph

You didn't miss anything by not reading Lynn Cheney's "romantic novel" but if you're interested in some excerpts, you can read them at the link below, or download the whole thing in a PDF file.

http://www.whitehouse.org/administration/sisters.asp

God, what a juvenile attempt at writing...

terryb wrote:

> "trisagion, atheists and gays?"

Why do you think so? But now that you bring it up, don't you think it's a bit much to be presenting Dick Cheney as a "fundamentalist Christian" the way this author does?: "Remember, Bush and his vice president Dick Cheney are fundamentalist Christians..." If you'll recall, not very long ago the Cheneys put on a publicity blitz celebrating events in their authoress daughter's life which would likely have been met by pained silence from fundamentalist Christian parents. I've never heard the Cheneys describe themselves as 'fundamentalist Christians,' nor have I ever heard any fundamentalist Christian so describe them. Have you? While I haven't personally read Lynne Cheney's contributions to the Literature of the West, from what I hear, her writing is not for the faint of heart.

In fairness to Mary Cheney, I don't actually know what her vocabulary is like, I was just making assumptions based on her sexual orientation, the reported fact that she is an avid hunter, and her former employment for the Coors Beer Company. For all I know, she could have the vocabulary of a 'Church Lady.' Is it this assumption that you are classifying as 'bigotry'? I've never personally gone to a gay bar, where Mary Cheney's employment used to take her; I'd be genuinely and pleasantly surprised to learn that the vocabulary you hear in such places is squeaky clean. Is that so?

And how do the atheists enter into it? Don't you like Alan Greenspan?

trisagion, atheists and gays?

terryb wrote:

> "trisagion, do i detect a little bigotry?"

Against whom?

"W" War II ?

The fast track to Impeachment?

trisagion, do i detect a little bigotry?

coyotita, you forgot one minor point. 1,000,000 dead iraqies.

Trisagion

I've a fantasy of attending a fundamentalist Christian picnic and shouting at everybody to FO and then pointing out that Dick Cheney and George Bush say it frequently to people.

anney wrote:
> "A rather inconsequential mention here:

> "Remember, Bush and his vice president Dick Cheney
> are fundamentalist Christians

>"In my life, I've known a lot of fundamentalist
> Christians, and I've NEVER heard one of them
> tell anybody "F*** Off" or
> curse at other people the way these two "fundamentalist
> Christians" do. They may be uptight, but clean language
> is almost always part of it."

This is certainly true. The potty-mouthed, frat-boy banter you hear from Mr. Bush's open mike, and the vile obscenities Mr. Cheney snarls at his foes, are not the kind of language you ever hear from fundamentalist Christians. I was watching Alan Greenspan, a professed disciple of atheist philosopher Ayn Rand, on TV, and he was shocked by the language he heard in the Nixon White House. So we know that the language used by right-wing Republicans is such as to shock even atheists. A fair conclusion is that these people are not fundamentalist Christians, nor do they spend much time hanging around fundamentalist Christians. Perhaps they think using this language makes them sound 'tough,' or maybe Mr. Cheney learned these words from his daughter, Mary.

KittyHegemann wrote:

> "Well, well, well. Bin Laden had three "wishes".
> All US military out of Saudi Arabia, oil up to
> $100 a barrel, and the US attack a Muslim country.
> He's pretty much gotten his wishes."

Good point. Only one of these three 'wishes' was a publicly stated demand: U.S. military out of Saudi Arabia. This, the terrorist's first and primary public demand, has been delivered just as he requested. How did the Bush Administration win a free pass from the media and the opposition for caving in to bin Laden's Number 1 demand? It's always a bad idea to appease terrorists, but that is just what this Administration has done.

Robert Kennedy believed that the CIA was involved with the murder of his brother, John F Kennedy. Robert Kennedy did not trust the FBI to investigate and hired his own investigators. He knew that J Edgar Hoover hated his brother.

We have now learned that there is evidence that both the FBI and CIA prevented testimony and evidence from appearing in commission reports on the Death of JFK.

9/11 is no different. Eyewitnesses and visual evidence was never presented to the 9/11 Commission. 9/11 Commission was made up of Conservatives and Neo-Conservatives and the Chief Investigator was one of the pro-ponents of Pax-Americana. Was there a cover up of 9/11? Did the FBI participate as an active participant in the "Obstruction of Justice"?

Research "Operation Cyclone" you will see who sponsored Islamic Militants

Words that make me want to cry:

"Then along comes Bush, Jr., not content to just "meddle" as his family has done. He's worse than the meddlers, though none were anything to write home about, because he intended to go in and crush the midEast to gain control of the oil. There seems to be no question now that this was his intention from the beginning."

I want to cry because I know that George W. Bush has sacrificed nothing to "gain control of the oil."
I want to cry because George W. Bush cannot even begin to feel the pain and loss felt by the families of those killed in Iraq, almost four thousand multiplied by the numbers in their respective families.
I know that it is true that it isn't just George W. Bush that is perpetrating this injustice on the people of this country and of other countries, so that down the line, all those who go along with this terrible president are just as wrong. I guess the big difference is that George W. Bush is doing it so freely, when he doesn't have to do it at all.

FROM
The Madness Of George W. Bush

"The Jungian analysis by Paul Levy, of Bush and the culture which maintains him, reaches deep into the American psyche. It should be studied and digested by everyone. If the citizenry would recognize that Bush's egomania is acting out a national illness, we would all be saner. If the US could integrate the "shadow" which Bush projects upon "the axis of evil," perhaps we could achieve world peace and start to solve global problem. A MUST READ." Carol S. Wolman, MD, Board Certified in Psychiatry

THE LIE

It is not that the threat of terrorism is unreal, but that Bush's policies in dealing with terrorism are actually fueling the fire. The way Bush is fighting terrorism is actually the very act which is invoking and creating more of it in the first place. It is as if he is fighting against his own shadow, which is a battle that can never be won. Bush is so dissociated from the darkness within himself that he splits off from it and tries to destroy it. Bush's inner process, because of the position of power he finds himself in, is getting dreamed up and played out on the world stage. ME disease is unique in that it collapses the boundary between inner and outer. Egophrenia is an inner disease of the soul that expresses itself via the medium of the outside world. We could even say that the inner core of egophrenia actually in-forms and gives shape to the outer universe so as to express itself.

By creating more of the very thing he is fighting against, Bush is enacting the repetition compulsion of the traumatized soul. In Bush's case, it is the repetition compulsion gone awry, to daemonic proportions, getting acted out on the world stage. To quote noted psychologist Rollo May, the daemonic is "any natural function which has the power to take over the whole person [or whole nation]…..the daemonic can be either creative or destructive [i.e, demonic]…..violence is the daemonic gone awry."

The daemonic aspect of the disease develops a certain autonomy and literally possesses the person or group, as it is self-generating, self-perpetuating and self-organizing in nature, like a closed and negative feedback loop. The person who is taken over doesn't suspect a thing, as the field secretly conspires and colludes with and enables their psychosis. For example, Bush, in his delusion, imagines he is divinely guided. His supporters want to believe this to feed their own adolescent fantasies of wanting to have a divinely inspired leader to take care of and protect them. Because of this need they invest, so to speak, in Bush's delusion, which just confirms to Bush all the more that he indeed is God's instrument. Bush and his followers are co-dependently and reciprocally feeding and supporting each other's unconscious narcissistic needs in a truly pathological, and ultimately self-destructive co-dependent relationship.

At the root of Bush's pathology is a deep dissociation. Like the terrorists, he has split-off from his own darker half, projecting the shadow 'out there,' and then tries to destroy this dis-owned shadow. By projecting the shadow onto each other, Bush and the terrorists are each seeing their own shadow reflected in the other. They see each other as criminals, as the incarnation of evil. By projecting the shadow like this, they locate the evil 'out there,' which ensures that they don't have to recognize the evil within themselves. It's interesting to note that the inner meaning of the word mirror is 'shadow holder.' Ironically, by fighting against their own shadow in this way, they become possessed by the very thing they are trying to destroy, thereby perpetuating a never-ending cycle of violence. To quote C. G. Jung, one of the greatest psychologists of the twentieth century, "The psychological rule says that when an inner situation is not made conscious, it happens outside, as fate. That is to say, when the individual remains undivided [not in touch with both the light AND dark parts of themselves] and does not become conscious of his inner opposite, the world must perforce act out the conflict and be torn into opposing halves."

Jung simply refers to projecting the shadow as "the lie." It's interesting to note that one of the inner meanings of the word Devil is 'the liar.' Projecting the shadow, to quote Jung, "deprives us of the capacity to deal with evil." Jung stresses the importance of consciously developing what he calls our "imagination for evil," which is to consciously recognize our potential for evil. This recognition means embracing and integrating our dark side into our wholeness, which is made up of both light and dark. If we have no imagination for evil, to quote Jung, "evil has us in its grip…….for only the fool can permanently disregard the conditions of his own nature. In fact, this negligence is the best means of making him an instrument of evil."

By projecting the shadow, Bush is unwittingly being a conduit for the deepest, archetypal evil to possess him from behind, beneath his conscious awareness, and to act itself out through him. At the same time, ironically enough, he identifies with the light and imagines that he is divinely inspired. To quote Jung, a person in a position of power who has become dissociated like Bush "even runs the grave risk of believing he has a Messianic mission, and forces tyrannous doctrines upon his fellow-beings." He then believes that any action he desires is justified in the name of God, as he can rationalize it as being God's will. Unable to self-reflect, he is convinced of the rightness of his viewpoint, which he considers non-negotiable. This is a very dangerous situation, as Bush has become unconsciously identified with and possessed by the hero, or savior archetype. This figure is religious in nature, as it derives from the transpersonal, archetypal dimension of the collective unconscious. Being inflated with the hero archetype, he (archetypically) wants to save the world from evil and to liberate the planet.

This is the height of irony since, in reality, Bush is acting as an unwitting conduit for evil by instigating wars and taking away people's freedoms. This incongruity brings into bold relief the severe schizoid split that characterizes Bush's condition. His inflation blinds him to the real consequences of his actions and is one of the easier to recognize aspects of his pathology. Being inflated due to an unconscious identification with an archetype is, in essence, an expression of having forfeited one's humanity, a state in which humility becomes impossible.

Bush has fallen into a state that is the embodiment of arrogance. Succumbing to the temptation of power, Bush has become corrupt, which is the inevitable consequence when one prefers power over truth. He has fallen into a vicious cycle where he has become addicted to power. Bush and his regime are compulsively driven to do everything and anything they can to hold onto the position of power they find themselves in. Not only do they not see the depraved nature of the situation they have fallen into, they don't want to see it. Being in the role of having power, there is a counter-incentive to self-reflect, which just reinforces the strength of the pathogen.

The inner name of ME disease is 'Mad Emperor' disease, as it is what happens when a person in a position of power falls prey to and become seduced by that power. As Al Gore points out, people who are after dominance and power "satiate their hunger for more power still by striking a Faustian bargain. And as always happens- sooner or later- to those who shake hands with the devil, they find out too late that what they have given up in the bargain is their soul."

At the root of Bush's process is an unwillingness and seeming inability to experience his own sense of sin, guilt and shame, as if he is afraid of being exposed, of being found out. He's clearly unable to feel any remorse and experience his own weakness and vulnerability, his own sense of failure. This threatens his narcissism too much. One aspect of Bush's pathology is 'malignant narcissism,' as he reacts sadistically to others who mirror back his guilt and don't support and enable his narcissism.

This inability to experience his shame and guilt sets in motion a self-perpetuating cycle of denial, cover-up and projecting the shadow, all of which are based on a lie. Bush then falls into an endless loop of hiding from his own lie, which is to say, from himself. This process allows Bush to become a conduit for egophrenia to take him over and incarnate its malignant aspect through him.

Jung comments on this resistance to self-reflection and endless cycle of self- deception by saying "Hysterical self-deceivers, and ordinary ones too, have at all times understood the art of misusing everything so as to avoid the demands and duties of life, and above all to shirk the duty of confronting themselves. They pretend to be seekers after God in order not to have to face the truth that they are ordinary egoists."

Falling victim to one's own deception as Bush has can have a very mesmerizing and gripping effect on others, as he appears so convinced of what he is saying and is able to project this conviction. To quote Jung, "Nothing has such a convincing effect as a lie one invents and believes oneself, or an evil deed or intention whose righteousness one regards as self-evident…..things only become dangerous when the pathological liar is taken seriously by a wider public. Like Faust, he is bound to make a pact with the devil and thus slips off the straight path." Bush has the seductive coherence of someone who is fanatically identified, like the typical fundamentalist, with only one side of an inherently two-sided polarity. Thomas Merton, commenting on the case of the obviously demented Nazi war criminal, Adolf Eichmann, points out "One of the most disturbing facts that came out in the Eichmann trial was that a psychiatrist examined him and pronounced him perfectly sane."

A key feature of malignant egophrenia is that it is very hard to recognize when someone is a carrier, because the person can seem so normal and even endearing. The person afflicted can be very 'charming' and have a certain type of charisma that can entrance those who don't see through their subterfuge. Concerned about nothing other than himself, a person stricken with egophrenia is in reality indifferent to other people's suffering, all the while professing his compassion, like a wolf in sheep's clothing.

Just like Hitler struck a chord deep in the German unconscious, Bush is touching something very deep in the American psyche. Bush is acting out on the world stage an under-developed psychological process that deals simplistically with issues such as good and evil. It's as if he hasn't grown out of and fully differentiated from the realm of mythic, archetypal fantasy that is typical of early adolescence. This immature aspect of Bush's process speaks to and resonates with those voters who support him, as it is a reflection of their own under-developed inner process.

Whereas Hitler's evil was more overt in its cruelty and sadism, Bush's dark side is much more hidden and disguised, which makes it particularly dangerous. People who vote for Bush are somehow blind to what is very obvious to others. It's as if they've become hypnotized and fallen under the spell that Bush is casting. Why would people vote for someone stricken with malignant egophrenia? People who support Bush are suggestible and susceptible to the same malady that Bush is embodying, as if they have a predisposition for it (based on their own trauma, dissociated psyche and tendency to project the shadow). Supporting Bush is a sign that a person not only doesn't see the deadly illness that is incarnating itself through Bush, but is an expression that this disease has taken up residence in their being and is using them to do its bidding.

this is business as usual for christianity. all you have to do is look at history. the bible is full of violence, and when the fundamentalist extremists take it literally, this is the shit you end up with. when the leaders like pat robertson, jerry falwell, billy graham and the like, spew their hate and bigotry, and the good christians remain silent and do not take them to task, then they become complicent. shame on you all. you talk about love and compassion, but you have no problem when violence overrides it all in the name of your religion. it's time for you christians to take a good hard look at yourselves, and get your shit together.

tbonez, that is quite helpful for understanding his character. But don't you wonder about how such a country as the US can be taken under this 'spell'?

Love of country, and the conviction that it is a good country should be taken in the context of what it is to be a human. Sure, we see ourselves as good - our family may have been good, our friends are good - at least some of them. We say, no one is perfect, but essentially we are good.

The 'no one is perfect part' is what gives us the power to be good. we acknowledge that we can make mistakes. With this acknowledgement, we are necessarily willing to listen to criticism. It is a pretty basic reflection that people cannot see their own failings, they need the criticism of others to be their mirror, to reveal to them what they can improve.

So what makes America different? Why can't Americans accept that their country is not perfect. Why must they wait out an eight year president when it is overwhelmingly obvious that the entire world sees him as a criminal? Why must Americans compulsively avoid the realization about their imperfection that becomes obvious to most children by the time they are struggling their way through puberty?

This is not America bashing. I would really like to know the answer to this question. Is it a fundamental flaw in the design of the country's political system? Is it somehow related to the way American nationalism has been defined? What causes it?

Nation of Sheep Ruled By Wolves Owned by Pigs! a recent pin I saw at a shop. I personaly adore the wolf however it fit the topic!! I think it is all a preditor prey plan for big business and no Vetrans benefits in the long haul.. Impeach the Bushman the greed monger and let's not see anymore of this MONKEY BUZINESS!

This explains Bush in a nutshell from Paul Levy's book "The Madness of George Bush"
A COLLECTIVE PSYCHOSIS

"ME(Malignant Egophrenia) disease is an Orwellian world where up is down, as its flawless illogic is convoluted and inverted at its core. Malignant egophrenia is crazy-making. It induces a very hard to recognize form of insanity. When we fall prey to egophrenia, we are unable to recognize that we are taken over, as we become bewitched by our own projections, accusing other people of doing what we ourselves are doing. For example, Bush is guilty of the very thing he accuses Saddam Hussein of when he calls Hussein, "A man who has defied the world," and "A man who has made the United Nations look foolish." Similarly, Bush is talking about himself when, referring to the terrorists, he says we are "facing a radical ideology with unalterable objectives to enslave whole nations and intimidate the world." He is unknowingly giving voice, shape and form to his unconscious shadow.

Part of the sinister nature of the disease is that when we point at it and call it by its true name—as being a form of insanity called ignorance—people who are stricken with the disease will see us as the one's who are crazy. Because egophrenia hooks us through our unconscious, when we are infected with it, just like a sociopath, we don't experience ourselves as being sick or needing help. When we are taken over by egophrenia, we always see the problem as existing in someone else.

In addition, when we are stricken with egophrenia, we think we are successfully hiding and concealing our shadow activities. We imagine that others can't see the underhanded nature of what we are doing, all the while not realizing that our criminal activities are their own revelation and could not be more obvious for all who have not fallen under our spell."

He also explains how this disease is contagious and spreads to all who are suseptible to it's spell(hence the whole administation). We also have to realize that we are in an age of enlightenment, and evil has a shelf life. This administration and perhaps our whole corrupt and unjust system is like rotting meat. It stinks, it creates a very unpleasant environment, yet it is in a self detruction stage of devolution. The hope is that just like rotting meat it will soon be gone!! Justice, truth, and our creative spirit will rise again because they are eternal and indestructible. Homeostasis or balance will be restored because that is the natural order of the universe.

I HAVE NEVER BELIEVED BUSH IS A CHRISTIAN...he is a blackhearted discompassionate treasonous nefarious nabob.and in NO WAY, by any stretch of the imagination.. resembles or speaks for jesus christ.

Jungleboy has it right:

"It also for control of the American people. This war thing. Once the corporations take over we are going to be in a perpetual caste society, unable to fend for ourselves. Look at the housing trends, the subprime lending, the super industrial agro farming and the control with insurance, liability and medical, control over medicine production with patents, manipulation of science for political gain. Power. Oil is just the building block. Power lies in control of the markets, the people and their economy."

The Corporate Elite wants complete control of the world economy and oil is the key, not only because it is so useful but because it gives those nations who possess it a certain amount of independence from WTO, World Bank etc. It is the basis of wealth in the Middle East just as gold used to be for us.
Another aspect is perpetual war means perpetual profits for the likes of Haliburton, Blackwater, Bectel etc.
Let us not forget that even if they pulled out all our military
(which will not happern because they are already planning a big base on the border of Iran), there will still be a private corporate "security force" there of 180,000.

Thank you for that article, it was well documented. The irony is, countries have a right to defend themselves against US led aggression. The US is the only country waging wars they can'not win - Afghanastan, Iraq, etc ... What makes them believe they can win a war with Iran. If Bush is the "Christian" he portrays himself to be, and if he read the bible, he will note that an Arab Confederacy will develope, a United European Union, and other Alliances. Bush doesn't care when last summer Isreal bombed a clearly marked UN Station and a Refugee Camp for Palestianian women and children. Weapons of Mass Destruction - are they any safer in Bush's hands? No one wants forced US democracy or the American lifestyle. Bush's intelligence over Iraq's WMD was false, why should we believe him when it comes to Iran.
Islam is worldwide, and if Bush continues his values on other countries, soon suicidal bombers will be showing up in Disney World, and on American streets. What would Jesus do, he certainly didn't say kill thousands of woman, children, etc.. in my name. He should read his history books and look at Hitler .... I am so surprised no one has ofted him whenever he traveled to the Middle East, he and Dick Cheney, the worse Politicians in USA history. May all you have a great Ramadan ... may you be blessed and prosper.

Watch out for World War III, coming our way.
Given the projective, baiting nature of neocons
and too many Republicans in general, examine
their criticisms of anybody very carefully,
since they nearly always are describing something very screwed up about themselves.

If they call you a defeatist, it is because
they are self-destructive. And destructive
of all Americans. If they call you a flippety
flopper it is because they constantly flip-flop
on the reasons for us being in Iraq. If they
call you anything it's probably because they
lack personal decency.

But the projection idea runs much deeper. If Quaggenbush or Rove, Petraeus, Cheney, McCain,
Rice or anybody advances the idea for the
thousandth time that after we leave in a big
pullout, al Quaeda will follow us over here
and....

consider the details of their allegation carefully. For what they are describing is
what will happen if we stay.

The only way we can lessen pressure on Iraq,
Iran and the world-- so it doesn't hate us
so much, is to remove every single American.

And that is the way to do it, following the
advice of defense analyst Stephen Biddle, hardly a turtle dove. In words reminiscent
of Vietnam era discussion, he said either
flood Iraq with troops or remove all Americans, one or the other but nothing in
between. "Stop the bleeding," people would
say during Vietnam.

Nobody is worse than the neocons at looking
into the future, over and over. Perhaps all
they'll need to start World War III is to
attack Iran. No matter what they do, the
situation in Iraq is more volatile than they
imagine.

It's a bit like Stendhal on love. "A love
is either getting better all the time or it
is getting worse all the time."

Well, we already know that Iraq isn't getting
better all the time so...

And we know that the world isn't getting safer
all the time so...

And if we have any sense at all, we know that
the world is hating us more and more because of Quaggenbush's insistent occupation. And when the world hates us enough...McCain's grim scenarios will come to pass.

Home now.

All to Relevant Quote:

How is the World Ruled & how do wars start?
Diplomats tell lies to journalists & then believe what they read.
(Karl Kraus, Austrian Press,1874-1936)

In view of the absurdity of this ill conceived plan to provides arms to the Saudis & others in this volatile region, and the history of other comparable policies of this administration, one can only conclude that the arms merchants are instrumental in its conception.

General Eisenhower's warnings concerning the dangers of the military industrial complex were preceded by Albert Einstein in 1932 when he cited munition makers as the main thrust for war machines. Warnings concerning the need to scrutinize such misadventures by the executive branch had earlier been made by John Adams and other constitutional framers.

Unfortunately this war is an example of the neglect and/or ignorance of pertinent history, along with the profiteering motives. Such misguided disasters can occur only when a compliant & apathetic populace allows their legislators to tolerate these types of abuses from arrogant and unlearned administrations guided by special interests.

Too bad that picture wasn't taken in a above coffin shot at the funeral.

That thought gave me a flash of hope.

That picture of George is one for the history books

America is the second state of Israel!

don't you just love religion? so full of love and compassion.

What a tragedy...what a crime...that these dastard individuals would bite the very hand that feeds them...alas my poor country, mine own US of A..my bastion of Democracy, my nurse, my guide, my anchor of my purest Demacratic thoughts, my home...I knew thee well!

Israel + Neocons + Christian Fundamentalists + Israeli Controlled American media + Israeli controlled Congress + Alan Dershewitz(doesn't matter if the name of this traitor is spelled incorrectly) and other assorted apologists i.e.(George Will, Bill O'Reilly) + Israeli infested think tanks + AIPAC and other treacherous israeli cheer-leading organizations in our midst =

The Four Horsemen of the Apcalypse: WAR(Palestine...Lebanon...Iraq...Iran?) PESTILENCE FAMINE DEATH.

Everything paid for with American treasure and what is much more precious...with American blood.

Well, well, well. Bin Laden had three "wishes". All US military out of Saudi Arabia, oil up to $100 a barrel, and the US attack a Muslim country. He's pretty much gotten his wishes.

Next stop - Iran!

I watched the movie, "Good Fellows" last night. It totally describes our current administration.....they are "good fellows", just take a look at the picture of Bush deep in prayer!

There is no doubt in my mind that it is being denied ArbeitMachtFrei! It has been for the entire 50 years I have been on this earth.

Oh I nearly forgot, the greatest SCOUNDRELS throughout Western Civilized History have draped themselves in their Countries Flag....

lillulu September 16th, 2007 2:36 pm
Right-wingers always wear a flag on their lapel?

The parallels between HITLER'S Germany and Bu$hCo America are striking...The use of patriotism, the use of religion, the use of propagandized Ultra Right Wing echo chambers like FOX and the use of National Symbols to promote nationalistic patriotism are examples amongst many.

Nazi Propaganda was designed to systematically manipulate public opinion, generally by the use of symbols such as flags, monuments, oratory, and publications. American based propaganda is distinguished from other forms of communication in that the Administration consciously and deliberately used it to influence group attitudes; all other functions are secondary. Thus, almost any attempt to sway public opinion, including lobbying...

When Hitler created a flag for the Nazi party, he sought to incorporate both the swastika and "those revered colors expressive of our homage to the glorious past and which once brought so much honor to the German nation" (red, white, and black were the colors of the flag of the old German Empire). He also stated that "As National Socialists, we see our program in our flag. In red we see the social idea of the movement, in white the nationalistic idea, in the swastika the mission of the struggle for the victory of the Aryan man, and, by the same token, the victory of the idea of creative work, which as such always has been and always will be anti-Semitic." (Mein Kampf)

So the Chimp strutting around pretending to be a true patriot is pretentious at best and a LIE at it's worst... In truth Bu$h has proven to be OBL's greatest partner in crime...

Why does the Chimp and the rest of the right-wingers always wear a flag on their lapel? Does that mean they care more about the country than someone who doesn't wear it every day? I'm sooo impressed.

Historical lessons, current events, and rational interpretation of intellegence have normally precluded egotism & theocracy for major decisions in our republic.

Unfortunately, this is not the case now. The current administration is manipulated by ego, the energy cartel,& the radical religious right wing to extents never before experienced in our history. The ill conceived invasion of Iraq, the plans to provide arms to some Middle East Countries, current suggestion to invade Iran, & the dreadful war on our environment are only some examples.

Those who object or oppose his policies can expect retalation( ie the dreadful character assassination of a trip;e amputee Viet Vet because he promoted an investigation into the9/11 disasster which Bush opposed.

Unless Americans begin reacting to logic rather than rhetoric, and take back our country from this illegally placed administration now, the rights that we have enjoyed for two centuries may evaporate--and Americans we can blame themselves for this.

Remember, Bush and his vice president Dick Cheney are fundamentalist Christians

In my life, I've known a LOT of fundamentalist Christians, and I've NEVER heard one of them tell anybody "F*** Off" or perpetrate willfully illegal wars of aggression, violating international treaties, international laws and callously deny the murder of over 1 million innocent civilians.....

IF MUSLIMS ARE TERRORISTS, CHRISTIANS ARE MORE THAN THAT. ADOLF HITLER KILLED OVER 6 MILLION JEWS IN THE NAME OF CHRISTIANITY?BIN LADEN KILLED ONLY SOME 3000.

Hitler's involvement with the Church:

a) Hitler was baptized as Roman Catholic during infancy in Austria.

b) As Hitler approached boyhood he attended a monastery school.(On his way to school young Adolf daily observed a stone arch which was carved with the monastery's coat of arms bearing a swastika.)

c) Hitler was a communicant and an altar boy in the Catholic Church.

d) As a young man he was confirmed as a "soldier of Christ." His most ardent goal at the time was to become a priest. Hitler writes of his love for the church and clergy:"I had excellent opportunity to intoxicate myself with the solemn splendor of the brilliant church festivals. As was only natural, the abbot seemed to me, as the village priest had once seemed to my father, the highest and most desirable ideal."-Adolf Hitler (Mein Kampf)

e) Hitler was NEVER excommunicated nor condemned by his church. Matter of fact the Church felt he was JUST and "avenging for God" in attacking the Jews for they deemed the Semites the killers of Jesus.

f) Hitler, Franco and Mussolini were given VETO power over whom the pope could appoint as a bishop in Germany, Spain and Italy. In turn they surtaxed the Catholics and gave the money to the Vatican. Hitler wrote a speech in which he talks about this alliance, this is an excerpt:"The fact that the Vatican is concluding a treaty with the new Germany means the acknowledgement of the National Socialist state by the Catholic Church. This treaty shows the whole world clearly and unequivocally that the assertion that National Socialism [Nazism] is hostile to religion is a lie." Adolf Hitler, 22 July 1933, writing to the Nazi Party

Hitler and the Popeg) Hitler worked CLOSELY with Pope Pius in converting Germanic society and supporting the church. The Church absorbed Nazi ideals and preached them as part of their sermons in turn Hitler placed Catholic teachings in public education. This photo depicts Hitler with Archbishop Cesare Orsenigo, the papal nuncio in Berlin. It was taken On April 20, 1939, when Orsenigo celebrated Hitler's birthday. The celebrations were initiated by Pacelli (Pope Pius XII) and became a tradition.

Each April 20, Cardinal Bertram of Berlin was to send "warmest congratulations to the Fuhrer in the name of the bishops and the dioceses in Germany with "fervent prayers which the Catholics of Germany are sending to heaven on their altars."(If you would like to know more about the secret dealings of Hitler and the Pope I recommend you get a book titled: Hitler's Pope: The Secret History of Pius XII, by John Cornwell)

h) Due to Hitler's involvement with the Church he began enacting doctrines of the Church as law. He outlawed all abortion, raged a death war on all homosexuals, and demanded corporal punishment in schools and home. Many times Hitler addressed the church and promised that Germany would implement its teachings:"The National Socialist State professes its allegiance to positive Christianity. It will be its honest endeavor to protect both the great Christian Confessions in their rights, to secure them from interference with their doctrines (Lehren), and in their duties to constitute a harmony with the views and the exigencies of the State of today."–Adolf Hitler, on 26 June 1934, to Catholic bishops to assure them that he would take action against the new pagan propaganda "Providence has caused me to be Catholic, and I know therefore how to handle this Church."-Adolf Hitler, reportedly to have said in Berlin in 1936 on the enmity of the Catholic Church to National Socialism

To BillB:

You think things might have been different after 9/11 had Gore been President. I think Gore would have had to step down soon after the election due to "health" reasons which would have put Israel's choice for our President in power. Joe Lieberman.

Which means we would not only be where we are right now in the world, but probably worse. Iran would already have been thrown into the nuclear stone age.

"Remember, Bush and his vice president Dick Cheney are fundamentalist Christians."

You lost me when you wrote that inaccuracy. They could say they're chimpanzees but that wouldn't make it so.

"AND SO IT GOES"...great article

Why the US has never been able to work itself into the same kind of feeding frenzy that came after 9/11 is a complete mystery to me? If we would have George Bush would have been kicked out of office years ago and impeached his first term. The man is an insult to this great country. He doesn't even bother hiding his corruption anymore. It sticks out all over him like festering sores. But, no one in this country seems to care but a few of us agnostic's who aren't supposed to have enough moral's to know the difference between right and wrong! But, the Christian's don't care! Perhaps because most of them are as corrupt as he is. It doesn't seem like this nation has the will to have a decent government anymore. When the planes hit the world trade center our moral's crumbled to the ground like the trade center did. Most people have become passe about corruption. It's acceptable behavior especially among Christian's. As long as you are doing it in God's name that makes it justifiable. So, I have lost all faith in this country to know the difference between right and wrong!

OIL OIL OIL !!!! Never have so many paid such a high cost to benefit so few. Not to mention that the so few shouldn't be benefited at all.

"If they pursued peace instead of war - like JFK did, they would stand a good chance of being murdered."

Reminders of the military coup & assassination of Diem --

http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB101/index.htm

JFK also invented the missile gap in the 1960 campaign.

While he did pursue nuclear test bans, he was also still very much a cold warrior. A few years back, one of the widows -- Schlesinger's, maybe? -- perhaps Sargent Shriver's? said that there was an atmosphere of violence in the administration, partly because the civilian advisors were always trying to sound as tough or tougher than the generals.

A peace-president is a contradiction; there will be no peace until we do away with the aristocratic rule which our creaking Constitutional apparatus perpetuates.

geoff29,

Excellent points! Especially those Five stages of Journalist development. I heard Parenti speak once about 6 years ago, I'll have to read up on him some more.

And just one point to the "911 Truth" people...

When you deny that anyone would would want to strike back at the US, choosing the key symbols of US economic and military hegemony, you cut off the most important discussion of all - discussion of a half-century of US imperialism, whose victims would equal thousands of September 11's.

Bush and Cheney are lackies for the ruling elite.

If they pursued peace instead of war - like JFK did, they would stand a good chance of being murdered.

Bush is not really a fundamentalist christian (he & cheney are agnostic). Bush pretends that he is so that he can get their votes and dollars. He's using them.

Seems that people already forget the prophetic work of Paul Virilio ("Pure War") showing Pentagon and other documents decades old that speak of their ambition to get "as much as possible of the U.S. economy onto a pure war footing...." WAR, PERMANENT WAR, was/is the goal....How else could our ears be stuffed with such absolutely useless fake "analysis"---It's THEIR country, THEIR oil, the colonial age is OVER, and nobody, nobody has the guts even to say why we're really there. Would "foreigners" and their military be welcome if they were "helping" us produce cheap Appalachian coal? Hell no! Would WE want "their" government here? No! So how many people have to die before we WAKE UP?

And eight of those Canadian soldiers killed in two separate incidents were done in by drugged, incompetent American Air Force pilots who dropped bombs on them from 10,000 feet up based on muzzle flashes they 'thought were enemy fire'. How do you determine who is shooting from 10,000 feet? At least those we call 'suicide bombers' have the guts to look their targets in the eyes.

It is mentioned in the article that 78 British have been killed in Afghanistan. My guess is that Americans don't even know that Canada is part of the Nato force and has lost more than 60 soldiers there since 2001. But who cares, its only Canada eh!

There is no Jihad or War; there is only America and the spoilsport she has elected President.

I'd been listening to Michael Parenti over the past couple of months. He's got some great things to say for anyone looking for yet more discourse similar to Chomsky's.

Parenti thinks at great length about the media. Here's a paraphrase of his take on the developmental stages of a conventional reporter:

stage one: goes out and investigates something writes expose and the editor says no that's silly we can't do that.

stage two: goes and talks to the editor first and the editor says forget it.

stage three: gets the idea and then dismisses it himself.

stage four: no longer gets the idea.

stage five: gets indignant when it's suggested that there's influences on him.

I would in large part agree with ArbeitMachtFrei on what it would take a person to be successful in the corporate world. However, I think these stages might affect life in any american "career" however noble. For example, take teachers and professors.

I would suggest that no matter what we do many of us may have found ourselves in a similar predicament as these four stages because, well, our livelihood depended on it. But, succeed under these circumstances, that might be troublesome.

I think you can see the divide in this country between those who conform, of whom bush is obviously a great example, and those of us who at some point find these stages deplorable.

my google buddhist thought of the day revealed this to me, serendipitously:

Is repetitive action virtuous action? If behaviour and conduct are merely repetitive processes then all human relationships actually cease. If I behave mechanically every day, - repeating a certain code of conduct which I have learnt, which I find profitable, or which is pleasant, repeating that over and over again, - my relationship with you ceases, completely - I have become a machine. - J. Krishnamurti...

A correction needs to be made. Neither Bush nor his vice presidents Dick Cheney are fundamentalist Christians. They are both Talmudic Jews. Bush is pretending to be a Christian and he is not. His family has always been Jewish since the time they came to America around the late 1700's. This is why neither of them have no respect for any life but there own and few other of this Talmudic friends. Dick Cheney is Jewish and always has been. (Not all Jews are followers of the ancient laws of the Babylonian Talmud and are not racist. They are normal human beings like everyone else). It is precisely for this reason that he had to commit genocide on the entire Iraq population and had to destroy there culture, loot there museums, and pound them into dust.

It also for control of the American people. This war thing. Once the corporations take over we are going to be in a perpetual caste society, unable to fend for ourselves. Look at the housing trends, the subprime lending, the super industrial agro farming and the control with insurance, liability and medical, control over medicine production with patents, manipulation of science for political gain. Power. Oil is just the building block. Power lies in control of the markets, the people and their economy. The system is written out for us to fall into. With or with out religion as a cause(I'm sure it helps!), we would be falling into this. Sports...I'm sure the ads after and during don't play on some theme to get you riled as a form of control, emotionally. Just an example of easy manipulation without frame splicing or other subliminal techniques. I won't mention audio. All of this deregulation from our president isn't a good sign he is doing this jihad for religion. Oil... yeah right!

tbonez:

I read a book some time ago called "Wickedness" in which the author described a person as "wicked" who knows that a particular action is wrong and yet does it anyway.

The problem may ultimately boil down to "Obsession". Our system selects for Obsession. Those people who are "obsessed" (or "driven") are those who are most likely to "succeed". The problem, of course, is that Obsession is basically a form of mental illness since the obsessed or driven person sacrifices all other considerations to obtain his/her objective. For example, Bush/Cheney want the OIL and are willing to commit genocide to get it.

In our society, the standard of measurement is typically rate-of-return-on-investment, i.e., quick profits. Such a unidimensional standard of success implies an absence of moral choice since the preferred action is always that which maximizes quick profits. As such, our system would seem to be inherently Evil to the extent that it implies an absence of moral choice. The system is the problem. Bush/Cheney/Congress are just manifestations of the system.

When I read the First Amendment to the US Constitution I can't help but think that it was not an accident that the Founding Fathers juxtaposed Freedom of Speech and Association next to Freedom of Religion. This was not sloppy drafting. My view is that the Founding Fathers, who were devout Christian Liberals, correctly saw that Freedom of Choice is essential for man's religious development. Each man must be FREE to pursue his/her own unique individual Calling and perfect his/her unique relationship with God. To deny Man this Liberty is EVIL.

WW3 Has Already Started or: 18 Ways To Stop The Bomb
http://www.chycho.com/?q=stopthebomb

"For us to be able to prevent nuclear Armageddon that the United States proposes we must be as diligent as those who propose it. If they are intend on using all options to contain Iran, then we must consider all options to contain them. The first step in resisting is to educate ourselves and those that follow us. War is no longer an option if humanity is to survive."

Only half-truth.

This war is for control of the Middle East and oil, not Bin Laden=Bin Bush. You serve to distract the reader from the real issue when you concentrate only on emotionally laden ones.

Hmmm...Something fishy in Denmark...
or IS there...??

1) Experienced U.S. Pilots Provide Answers as to Planes' Crash into Buildings

In the days following 9/11, a private group of US military & civilian pilots held a seminar to evaluate this crucial feature of the official story. Could the hijackers have flown those jets with pin-point accuracy? Their findings: "The so-called terrorist attack was in fact a superbly executed military operation carried out against the USA, requiring the utmost professional military skill in command,communications and control. It was flawless in timing, in the choice of selected aircraft to be used as guided missles and in the co-ordinated delivery of those missiles to their pre-selected targets."

One of the organizers of the seminar, retired Colonel Donn de Grand-pre, said that it would be impossible for novices to have taken control of the four aircraft and orchestrated such a complicated operation, which obviously had, as a prerequisite military precision of the highest order.

Another was a U.S. Air Force officer who flew over 100 sorties during the Vietnam War. He concluded that " Those birds either had a crack fighter pilot in the left seat, or they were being maneuvered by remote control."

- Webster G. Tarpley,
9/11: Synthetic Terror Made in USA (2005)

-----------------------

US Fighter Pilot Looks Back at the Scrambling of Fighter Jets on 9/11

"...If normal communication and common sense action had taken place between the airlines,air-traffic control,FAA,NORAD and the interceptor bases, the interceptors would have arrived in time to save both the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, with many minutes to spare. So while I concluded that the fighter pilots themselves were not culpable,somebody was. The question is,who was it?

One clue is that in June of 2001, just 3 months before 9/11, a new directive came out at the Pentagon and it stated that all requests to NORAD for intercepting hijacked airliners had to be approved by the Secretary of Defense (Donald Rumsfeld)..."

--Dr. Robert M. Bowman,"Some Dare Call it Treason",

excerpt from his Presentation to the Intl. Citizens' Inquiry Into 9/11,
Toronto,Canada,
May 30,2004.

---Dr. Robert M. Bowman is President of the Institute for Space and Security Studies, Executive Vice President of Millennium III Corporation, and Presiding Archbishop of the United Catholic Church. Culminating a 22-year Air Force career in 1978, Col. Bowman was Director of Advanced Space Programs Development for the Air Force Space Division.

-----------------------------------------------

2) Trading skyrocketed in options that bet on a drop in UAL Corp. and AMR Corp. stock in the days before terrorists crashed hijacked United and American airlines jets into the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. Morgan Stanley Dean Witter & Co., which occupied 22 floors of the 110-story 2 World Trade Center, and Merrill Lynch & Co., with headquarters near the destroyed twin towers, also experienced pre- attack trading of 12 times to more than 25 times the usual volume in so-called put options that profit when stock prices fall, according to Bloomberg data.

Now, securities regulators in the U.S., Germany, Japan and Hong Kong say they are investigating whether terrorists raised money from insider trading on their knowledge of attacks that devastated New York's financial district and closed U.S. stock markets for four days.... Some airline, insurance, and brokerage stocks had jumps in the days before the Sept. 11 attack in so-called put options, which profit when a company's shares fall.

One day before two American Airlines jets were hijacked and crashed, for example, 1,535 contracts changed hands on options that let investors profit if AMR stock falls below $30 per share before Oct. 20. That was almost five times the total number of those October $30 put options traded before Sept. 10, according to Bloomberg data. AMR shares fell $11.70 today to $18.."

- Bloomberg Financial News,Sept.18,2001 http://www.themodernreligion.com/terror/wtc-unusualtrading.html

Marcy Gordon, "Pre-attack trading probed", Associated Press, October 3, 2001
---- http://www.detnews.com/2001/business/0110/03/b03-308879.htm

Material above (and more) can be found at:

www.canadianactionparty.ca/cgi

whatfools September 15th, 2007 8:13 pm
Ah yes, Monsters. Monsters from the ID. Bush's ID.

Forbidden Planet.

Anyone who believed Bush's evidence when he was beating the drums to wage war on Iraq was wilfully blinding themselves. Anyone with half a brain could see the weakness of the evidence. America was obsessed with wreaking revenge against someone, anyone, and Iraq was the weakest enemy to beat on. Bully tactics.

The seeds of Bad Karma have been sown and the consequences will be reaped.

Yet it remains within America's grasp to redeem itself by withdrawing now and letting Iraq settle into its own equilibrium. This likely means a Theocracy, Shiite, more oriented toward Iran than America. Too bad Bush.

Would Gore have done better? Undoubtedly. Bush is on track to being the president with the greatest number of vacation days. Gore would have worked, and he would have read the intelligence reports which warned of hijackings and Al Qaeda threats. But he would have kept it in perspective too. After all, Al Qaeda is just a handful of fundamentalists without much organization. They are fleas. We are wasting far too much time on them as is.

There isn't time now to impeach Bush and Cheney. America has to wait now until November, 2008 to change course. But the Democrats must be sent a message too otherwise they will follow the ruts in the road created by Bush's jihad.

"It was this stunning event which goaded President Bush into declaring his "global war on terror"."

Should read "...stunning event which enabled..."

"9/11 still remains a terrorist outrage perpetrated by a mere 19 men armed with Stanley knives."

Really? Amazing! It's incredible what a little "fundamentalism" can do isn't it?

Especially when backed by a war machine with more destructive power than that of the combined militaries of most of the rest of the world. America is still number one at something. We're the world leader is state sponsored terrorism.
http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/unsanam2
Please. It's time for last resorts.

You people are all missing something here. Take a good look at the picture of Bush in the article and it is obvious that he is communing wuth God and Jesus. How could anyone accuse him of any but angelic thoughts and purposes after seeing that pose?
We just have to admit God`s will is being executed in Iraq, and also here in the USA, and fall in line like good soldiers.

Grousefeather,

Back in June of this year, 41% of Americans in a Newsweek poll said they believed that Iraq was directly involved in "planning, financing, or carrying out the terrorist attacks of September 11th, 2001":

http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Poll_41_of_Americans_believe_Saddam_0624.html

That percentage is up 5 points from polls taken in 2004.

Even if Alan Greenspan says it is for oil, people are going to call him a liar. I know for just last night I said that to someone. He yelled at me and told me that I was absolutely insane.

As far as I am concerned playing the religion card is just as bad as the 9/11 ordeal. Using fear as a method of control is as old as earth itself. In my mind, the only way to put the bully's in their place is to expose the truth.

Believe me, there are Grousefeather!

Are we to believe that some people believe we're in Iraq for anything other than oil?

Imagine if, after the Japanese bombing of Pearl Harbor, the US declared war on China instead.

If 9/11 was genuinely perpetrated by a wealthy Saudi son and his mostly Saudi terrorists, why exactly didn't Bush declare war on Saudi Arabia?

The Newsweek magazine published the week of the 911 attack contained a column by I don't recall who proclaiming a distain for americans who would be "too philosophical" and instead demanded that it was time for America to fly into a "purple rage". My reply at the time (of course unpublished) was that philosophy is the art of clear thinking and purple rages are the last act of the desperate or the mad and usualy preseed distruction. It seems that finally americans of all stripes have had enough of purple rages and are starting to seek a little philisophical wisdom. Let's hope not too little too late.

ArbeitMachtFrei--Perhaps a viable solution to this lack of morality in people assuming positions of power can be solved with legislation. Not so sure how it would work in the private sector, but say we lobby congress to enact a law that subjects any official assuming a high level position to a lie detector test. In this test questions pertaining to the persons moral character would be explored. This test would be pass or fail and manditory if they wished to pusue a life in civil service. Only after successful completion of this test could these officials appear before congress for a confirmation hearing. FOIA records would be displayed for the general public to better judge their elected officials. I feel it is not the ultimate solution but could go a long way to clearing out the sess pool in DC.

This just in:

From The Sunday Times (UK)

September 16, 2007

Alan Greenspan claims Iraq war was really for oil

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/article2461214.ece

AMERICA's elder statesman of finance, Alan Greenspan, has shaken the White House by declaring that the prime motive for the war in Iraq was oil.

In his long-awaited memoir, to be published tomorrow, Greenspan, a Republican whose 18-year tenure as head of the US Federal Reserve was widely admired, will also deliver a stinging critique of President George W Bush's economic policies.

However, it is his view on the motive for the 2003 Iraq invasion that is likely to provoke the most controversy. "I am saddened that it is politically inconvenient to acknowledge what everyone knows: the Iraq war is largely about oil," he says.

Greenspan, 81, is understood to believe that Saddam Hussein posed a threat to the security of oil supplies in the Middle East.

Britain and America have always insisted the war had nothing to do with oil. Bush said the aim was to disarm Iraq of weapons of mass destruction and end Saddam's support for terrorism.

And here:

http://www.thewest.com.au/aapstory.aspx?StoryName=418891

=====

Finally, someone in Bush's administration (even if you don't like him) reveals the administration's actual reason for invading Iraq.

Jungleboy posted this on another thread so I am reposting. Green Peril",ie. Islam, the created threat.( see http://www.cato.org/pubs/pas/pa-177.html )

I'm so tired of this administration and the neocons promoting my religion in a negative light. One easily tires of the Alan Dershowitzs, the Daniel Pipes, the Rumsfelds the Wolfowitz etc. and one is constantly astounded at how many people don't see through their obvious propoganda and buy into it. Somedays its downright frightening. This is the holy month of Ramadan. We are praying and fasting for peace in the Middle East and here at home in the USA. We are all the children of Abraham please don't forget this.

I recall that there was a book published a couple of years ago discussing how persons with psychopathic personalities tend to succeed in the corporate world. I can't recall the title: "Snakes in Suits" (???).

It's an important subject as it relates to the moral development of human civilization. Human beings are, perhaps, unique in that we can perceive time, and, as a result, we have the ability to reflect on different courses of action: "I can either do A, B, or C." This mental characteristic of human beings gives rise to Ethics and Morality.

But, curiously, there seems to always be a group of people who don't reflect upon moral choices. For these people, the choice is not to make a moral choice between different courses of action, but rather to simply do whatever the most powerful person wants. Such people are very dangerous since they basically seek to destroy all moral choice. By destroying moral choice, they, in turn, destroy all moral development. They destroy man's opportunity for moral perfection. They destroy man's ability to move closer to God. Such people are Evil.

Did anybody find out why Bush and Cheney 'mistakenly' ordered those six nuclear warheads flown from North Dakota to Louisiana?

Someone better start an inventory of all nuclear weapons immediately, before millions are incinerated.

Once people realize that 9/11 was carried out by factions within our own government we can truly determine who are the real terrorists. We will never be able to collectively confront the "real" enemy until we come out of this powerful denial. . It showed just how powerful this "shadow" government was and to what depths it has infiltrated our society. To truly get at the root of this you must anwer the 3 M's. Motive,Means, and Money. Who had the motive was it a guy in a cave on dialysis who conveniently appears in videos when the administration is at a low point looking years younger? Or a faction of our own government which includes members from PNAC who called for a "New Pearl Harbor" which would get the American people behind war in the middle east??Who had the means again a guy in a cave on dialysis, or a group that had the power to make our North American defenses stand down when it was most convenient or take down buildings with military precision?? Who had the money again a guy in a cave on dialysis, or a group that specializes in "black ops" and has access to unlimited supplies of money related to drug trafficing, money laundering, and a whole host of illegal treasonous practices??? We must get over this delusion if we are to move toward bringing the true perps to justice. For the most part 9/11 was a "pychological" attack on the masses. It increased the fear factor to new levels. The orchestrators know that a population in fear is POWERLESS. It also made people travel down the rabbit hole. We are at the point where we are dealing with a conspiracy so vast that most are unwilling to touch it, or to follow where it leads. Our only hope is to expose this group of shawdow dwellers to the light. Our republic cannot survive with people pulling strings of this magnitude under the radar.

OK we have to look how Dubya got into office in the first place. Clinton had stepped out of bounds and was caught. Then the party was judged by the public ( convinced by the republicans ) in a negative way. Then add the debate between Gore and Bush, when bush said " he is dong that fuzzy math ".Gore just laid back and did not stand up and fight for his position. Blame Billy and Big Al. Then comes 9/11, that must have been planned for sometime ( all while Clinton was Irag was being bombed ) , so had Gore gone into office would 9/11 happened ? Probably. Would Gore acted differently than bush ? Hell yes, but we would not have been in the shape we are today.
Based on the fact Gore would have gone into office means he would have been strong that evening of the debate and told the whole USA that bush knew nothing . Now how do we unring that bell ? Who supplies the other guys guns ? Who wants to pay more money for oil ?? why in 'ell is THORIUM not being used ?

"In my life, I've known a lot of fundamentalist Christians, and I've NEVER heard one of them tell anybody "F*** Off" or curse at other people the way these two "fundamentalist Christians" do. They may be uptight, but clean language is almost always part of it."

Back in '99, when the Beast was just a Beastling, he was asked during a 'debate' which philosopher had most influenced them politically & he piped up "Jesus Christ - cuz he changed my heart!" Again, the off-note.

One of the second-or-third rankers in among the Cons -- neo or traditional doesn't really matter much -- once told a liberal sibling of mine, "You don't think I really believe that shit, do you?", referring to the moderately conservative Episcopalianism they both professed.

The imperialists can afford to dump the devout as the latter distance themselves (as a significant number are) from a bunch that have manipulated them -- but it won't matter much, since there is no real opposition to the imperial ethos as a whole. All the 'front-runners' subscribe to the gospel that "THEY" are out to destroy "US" -- the difference is that one side says that Iraq is the wrong fight and they want to fight an equally-long & equally-exhausting one, in which America's "Moral authority" *chokegasp* is "reaffirmed" or "re-established" . . .

It's not a "paranoid search for ideological monsters". It's a big lie designed to smooth the way for raw imperialism, control of the world's resources, and consolidation of wealth and power into the hands of global corporatists. Can't do it without a big lie.

Ah yes, Monsters. Monsters from the ID. Bush's ID.
.
Are we any 'safer' with Darth Cheney's Storm Troopers on the loose? Is it not better to trust The Force? Can we not shift our world view from projecting fear and hate to projecting understanding and compassion upon our universe? The Kingdoms of Heaven and Hell are all about us, we can live in either by our own outlook, by our own point of view. We need not sacrifice blood, treasure or other burnt offerings on someone else's altar to reach paradise.
.
Bush/Cheney's Global War on Terror is just a greed based fear campaign. Their greed, our fear, the world's terror.
.
We've all been Neo-Conned.

Indeed we should never lose sight of the overwhelming betrayal by Bush & Co., when they deceived us into War. And the Media, either joining into the delusion or sitting frightened on the sidelines, did nothing to pull us out of the madness.

Recall the moment this bad, bad man stood in front of us and declared the start of Shockenaw. He seemed in a trance; he seemed an alien to any world vision of peace and cooperation. He committed a crime.

A rather inconsequential mention here:

Remember, Bush and his vice president Dick Cheney are fundamentalist Christians

In my life, I've known a lot of fundamentalist Christians, and I've NEVER heard one of them tell anybody "F*** Off" or curse at other people the way these two "fundamentalist Christians" do. They may be uptight, but clean language is almost always part of it.

And this, maybe not so inconsequential:

No matter how sensational its impact, 9/11 still remains a terrorist outrage perpetrated by a mere 19 men armed with Stanley knives.

If there were 19 men armed with Stanley boxcutters, most of them were Saudis, and the Saudi Arabian government as well as the Saudi royal family continues to fund al Qaeda and are on very friendly terms with Bush. Who's the jihadist?

While nothing excuses terroristic acts, from what we've finally begun to understand, many midEasterners hate the US and other Western nations because of their meddling in midEastern political affairs for decades, all in their own self-interests.

Then along comes Bush, Jr., not content to just "meddle" as his family has done. He's worse than the meddlers, though none were anything to write home about, because he intended to go in and crush the midEast to gain control of the oil. There seems to be no question now that this was his intention from the beginning.

To many Americans, Bush IS a jihadist who's never been the victim of any crime committed by a Muslim. Instead, he's proactively blood-thirsty and a thief, liar, and warmonger. It's no wonder so many people don't believe the government story about 911 -- people are all over the place, guessing, speculating, making declarations, blaming Bush, etc. 911 may have been committed by jihadists, but a lot of people are wondering WHICH jihadists.

anney wrote:

> "TrisagionSeraph

> "You didn't miss anything by not reading Lynn
> Cheney's "romantic novel" but if you're interested
> in some excerpts, you can read them at the link below,
> or download the whole thing in a PDF file."

http://www.whitehouse.org/administration/sisters.asp

My goodness gracious! Looks like the apple did not fall far from the tree...