Bring on the Green Party. Please.

The dems are a pretty pale lot (so to speak) and do not represent the progressive movement in the USA. Triangulations they called it in the Clinton years - ie. being just left of the crypto-fascists and maneuvering politically to be just a "little bit better" than the repubs is disgusting, spineless and cowardly. ie. democrats. Sucks to 'em all, I say.
=Terry

Nancy Peloski cannot win, because she is a lapdog for Bush, if you support a dictator, then your are also a dictator. Perhaps she is another Eva Braun?

Thank you for your nice words, Ken. It is so wrong that young people don't even know how much ground we have lost, what this country used to provide for it's citizens, and that they have been repeatedly told that Social Security won't be there for them when it's so easily fixable - just include all taxable income in Social Security. The rich get a big break. No one else does.

A Pogoian Insight: The "party" is us. We are the Democratic party. I revisited all of the Democratic candidates and read their statements on all the issues. Biden is closest to my sentiments. Maybe someone else is yours. You decide. Then support your candidate. Ken Hausle there have been many extraordinary comments in this discussion forum and they bring me lots of hope that the people's party still has strength. It needs basic concentration. That has always been a problem for Democrats, they are a loose bunch. Someone, hubcap_halo, made mention of that and I thought it was very insightful. jonabark (Sept6 10am) made very clear points. And LiberalBoy's cry for TERM LIMITS is really excellent because there is nothing more scary to politicians than term limits. They cannot set up powerbases, or if they try to create a machine, it is a lot harder. With the blogosphere, it is now even harder for ratfinks to get away with anything. Libertarians are anathema to me and totally self-serving. I wouldn't give them a piece of pig crap.

A parliamentary system would be interesting, if anything like England's then we would really see the factions exposed for what they are, the rich vs. the poor vs. labor, vs. corporations, etc., etc. But dream on Umlaut. We are closer to a Machiavellian monarchy than ever in our history and thank the watchers most of the rats are abandoning the ship.

Grappa what economic system are you proposing instead of capitalism? And the planet will save itself. It's people who need saved… from themselves.

BigPhatJay is a pathological killer who has a thin brain.

And Malinche was treated like women have historically been treated, as slaves then demonized. That day is gone! Isn't it? And who betrayed who in that piece of history (herstory)? Typical male chauvinism.

thedeed is making the most rational plea. Learning to get the votes is the clue. We whine and moan about Bush (I do too) but there is only one solution, get rid of him and get rid of Republicans like him in the way Americans as a "coalition" can,"as thedeed suggests, at the voting booth. It is a national malaise that needs fixed.

i so agree with kathyodat.......she is incredible.....

Thank you, Zell, you put it exactly right. When I think of the opportunities we had when I was young and what young people have to look forward to now, I feel sad for them. When I was growing up, we used to go to a community park, and the playground director would let us check out playground equipment - balls, etc by leaving a jacket or belt as collateral. College was free, so were zoos and aquariums and campgrounds and parks. Being poor wasn't hopeless.

Ever since the Reagan "revolution" the infrastructure has been left to rot, the poor have been abandoned and the middle class is disappearing. We need to turn that around. This concentration of wealth at the top is destroying our country. They just take the money and run. They don't reinvest it in the infrastructure, or education, or public health, or even a wage people can live on. We need to fight back. I think we should declare every 11th day of the month a day we refuse to contribute to their greed. A no compliance day.

Hi there, clarity,

"Comments equating Bush's executive power grap with Hitler are an insult to intelligent people and serve only to alienate those who make them as the Looney Left"

Not just his executive power grab _ his murder of Iraqi and Afghan civilians and his sacrifice of troops' lives for his financial and political gain. Few things are more unspeakable evil, and the comparison to Hitler is legitimate.

One reason for decent Americans' inability to stop this madness has been refusal to see how astonishingly bad it really is. Bush's abuse have strayed beyond politics and are now in the realm of basic human morality. It's not a matter of which team one cheers on in a football game. Even many critics, possibly like yourself, are in denial about how bad it's become. That's understandable _ it's really hard for us Americans to comprehend that the worst of the worst can emerge from our culture. It really is difficult. I understand.

But we do have a responsibility to face it down, and fora like this are where those of us who are trying to reclaim our country will talk about it. It's not just a matter of "blowing off steam" _ it's a discussion about a severely awful reality and how to tackle it. Step 1 is usually, like in a 12-step program, a matter of accepting the fact that there's a problem. And there is. Not just some "executive power grab." Those of us who are older see our country falling apart, and it's ghastly.

Smug Libertarian ideologues like "MtnGoat" _ I hope you're not one of them _ are apparently posting here to have fun with their despised "Liberals." Thanks to Common Dreams' decency, they're certainly free and welcome to do so. But, if they don't like the response, they should take their hobby elsewhere. We are neither loony nor "left." Just normal, decent people who care about our country and world.

Thanks again, Common Dreams. Keep the faith.

ONE THING THE REPUBLICANS DO THAT WE PROGRESSIVES DON'T IS COMPROMISE AT LEAST WITH EACH OTHER, AND VOTE TO WIN FOR THE TEAM AS A WHOLE.

THEY STICK TOGETHER FOR THE TEAM AND WORK TO GET THEIR INDIVIDUAL AGENDAS PASSSED ONCE THE COMPROMISE CANDIDATE IS IN OFFICE.

HOW ELSE COULD POOR EVANGELICAL KANSANS AND LIBERTARIAN GUN LOVERS AND CORPORATE MONEY REPUBLICANS POSSIBLY VOTE FOR THE SAME CANDIDATE?

WITH SPEAKER PELOSI, JOHN CONYERS AND CINDY S. HAVE MUCH MORE POWER AND INFLUENCE. IF YOU THINK PELOSI IS ANYTHING AKIN TO DENNIS HASTERT, YOU'RE NOT SEEING STRAIGHT OR CLEARLY.

WITH A CONTINUED RIGHT WING ADMINISTRATION, THEY AND THE REST OF US JUST HAVE MORE CHANCE OF ENDING UP IN JAIL.

UNTIL WE AS PROGRESSIVES CAN UNITE BEHIND A WIDER MESSAGE, WE WILL REMAIN FRAGMENTED LOSERS JUST AS ROVE WOULD LOVE US TO REMAIN. AND YES FOLKS, THAT MEANS COMPROMISING AND WORKING WITH PEOPLE THAT DON'T
DO EVERYTHING YOU WANT THEM TOO.

LARGER ISSUE: WHAT WE REALLY NEED IS CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM AND A BREAKUP OF TOTAL CORPORATE MEDIA MONOPOLIES. IT'S THE MONEY FOLKS.

I agree with some things said, but people who are hunger striking outside someone's house, (especially if you plan on hunger striking outside mine), should consider their role in the mutual alienation. I know from personal organizing experience that having been falsely accused of something I didn't say by certain people and then attacked subsequently for pointing out it wasn't physically possible that I could have said what I was accused of saying led to more extreme attacks. Granted, the original accuser recanted and admitted it was a lie, but how do you think it made me feel about the people I was supposedly working 'with'? The same has to be said of Pelosi. Its justified to 'hunger strike' outside her house? Is it justified to throw molotove cocktails at her car? Where do the organizers get off in thinking that they're not in part alienating certain representatives. I have no sympathy for papperazzi who get beaten down harassing (assaulting) celebrities 24/7. Our representatives have a right to personal space and dignity as much as any other citizen.

I agree with Earthian, check out & join Progressive Democrats of America (www.pdamerica.org) for their vision of holistic, systemic change and the fact that they work outside the system in activism & demonstrations etc as well as inside the Democratic Party to create a truly progressive majority.

Also, I encourage everyone to call Pelosi after hours and leave messages on her machine: 1 415 556 4862. Let's deluge her with demands for Impeachment, to stop funding Iraq occupation, to rescind the recent spying on citizens bill and to show our disgust that she refused to meet with the courageous fasting CodePink women . . .or anything else that so inspires us. Ring her phone off the hook.

Thank you Medea, and all the fabulous CodePinksters, for your wisdom, courage, vision & determination. You are an inspiration!!

Vince,

I was at that same march on a cold January. It was maybe the largest anti-war march ever. But marching isn't going to win it. I do applaud your efforts at voter registration. Though efforts of people like you hundreds of thousands of new voters were added to the polls in 2004 and we won the popular vote, if not the electoral college.

The question you pose is whether the system is irretrievably broken and what course a rational liberal person should take. Personally, I fear our democracy is in very treacherous waters and things can go very badly. However, we are at another turning point, and many people no longer believe the Republican propaganda and may be willing to take their chances with a Democratic President. We have the ability to make that Democratic President strong or weak.

I understand our system to be one in which various constituencies must form coalitions in order to win power. Republicans have been able to do this by organizing the religious right, turning out their people in droves, and minimizing their radical fringes. The came up with a storyline the public bought and bin Laden handed Republicans the fear card, which they have blasted us with ever since.

It is clearly very difficult to build a liberal coalition sufficiently strong enough to win because most Democrats are critical and independent thinkers. Republicans more naturally accept order, and maybe that is their weakness too.

Nevertheless, if we want to save America and make it the liberal democracy it should be, that is our task: Build the coalition and then do our field work to get the votes.

Unfortunately, most of us don't seem to have a clue about how to work in coalition. It means having to compromise, but we only do that to get more power through the coalition. We work together and help each other. We don't get everything we want, but at least we are heard and some attention is paid to our concerns, in direct relationship to our abilities in the coalition. The coalition, of course, would have values of caring for minorities and the weak, because that is what we all believe in.

The alternative to learning the skills necessary to function effectively in our coalition model is rather bleak. Deciding not to participate, or worse, participating by tearing down those closest to your own beliefs because they are not "pure" enough, is highly destructive. Not only is the opposing coalition empowered, but negativity and bitterness are the result.

One may believe that our democracy is failed and can't be saved -- that it is permanently controlled by the corporations and the wealthy. This might be true, and if so, one must adopt a philosophy of personal defense. I think maybe I might move to another country sometimes when I get discouraged.

But I reject that all is hopeless because I just can't accept it. I have spent a lot of my adult life trying to make democracy work the way I imagined it would when I was in school. I don't want the corporations to win. I'm not an artist or a musician and I can't work for the corporations, so its what I have to do. Fight the man, or give up. I am fighting the very best way I know how and giving them hell every chance I get. I may not win, but I'll at least be satisfied I did my best.

That's all I'm asking people to do: think this through and use the most rational, powerful course of action you can. People used to think one person could spark the revolution through a single deed. Those were the anarchists. Other people thought "a small group of people can change the world." I belong to the "coalition builders can save the world" group. We don't know if it will work, but no one has a better idea.

There can be little pretense anymore that Democrates and Republicans are anything more than faithful factions of a single party, dedicated to fossil fuel and Arms Contractor lobbies and to the U.$. as a global empire. .......WAKE UP AND SMELL THE FASCISM, AMERICA ITS THE NEW WORLD ODOUR !

Regarding whatever CommonDreams may have as problems, I think it is important to give them a chance to fix problems.

If something doesn't post, cut it into two parts and try each consecutively after waiting an hour or so.

Or write to editor@commondreams.org and pose a question or identify a problem and give them a chance.

The main editor at CommonDreams is a guy named Craig Brown. I see no evidence that he is anything but a true progressive. I look at the overall performance of the editing staff regarding the selection of articles and authors. I'm impressed. Some not-so-progressive articles appear. But we don't need for CD to be a censored place. Non progressive pieces may still be important. I trust Craig and the other editors and suggest that we readers give them a chance to come through anytime there are problems. They have created a great home for the progressive community here.

To support Cindy Sheehan for Congress here is her new official site:

http://www.cindyforcongress.com/

There isn't much there yet, but there will be in due time.

There is also an unofficial, unauthorized site which I can't yet validate as useful:

http://www.sheehanforcongress.com/

It has lots of videos of Cindy, but unless and until she endorses it, I can't fully recommend it.

As far as political activity by progressives, there are some simple things we can all do (which I've done where I live):

Join or start a progressive caucus in your state Democratic Party. (There are now over 20. To find yours search for "your state" and "progressive caucus". It will likely show up.) Ours in Kansas can be found at www.kansasprogressives.org.

and

Join Progressive Democrats of America (www.pdamerica.org)

and

Join and/or support local Green Parties and the Green Party of the United States (www.gp.org).

In Vermont, join the Vermont Progressive Party.

And there is no reason not to use a personal two-party strategy. Belong to your progressive caucus in the Democratic Party *and* the Green Party.

And be on the lookout for new progressive presidential candidates beyond Kucinich and Gravel. I was on a conference call with Salt Lake City's Mayor Rocky Anderson last night (a PDA event) and he might possibly run. He is one of us for sure, and is more movement-oriented than Dennis Kucinich (who supported Kerry in 2004).

Nancy "no more blank checks" Pelosi is such a disappointment. She is not unaware, she is not dumb or unschooled, she is a sellout, pure and simple. She never had any intention of bucking the system and I'm beginning to believe she was a setup from the beginning, a bargain with the neocons; a public face of change in exchange for allowing the madness to go on. She's complicit unlike Conyers who I think may have been threatened for his complicity. But this lady was part of the game from day one.

from what i've read so far, i agree...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_Malinche

Pelosi is the "Malinche" of the US progressive movement.

let me say one last thing, the 2nd message above (2:07) has been edited and should be changing (>95% confidence).

Peace,
Ken Hausle
* lets get all the planes down on the ground
** lets get all the nuclear subs back to shore
*** lets start making peace......why not?????????

oh yeah, and SCALE matters....big time...

hey phat jay --- so if there is some "thinning", i quess you have lots to loose, or are you not really all that "phat".

Personally, i'd just assume the "thinning" never start because it will become indiscrimanent....and that is totally random.....and i suspect incredibly unpleasant for everyone....

rather than thinning can't we just have some learning?????

Peace,
Ken Hausle

Let the chaos and revolution come, our species could stand to be thinned out and hardened.

It's hard for everyone to be farmers even though I agree with you in concept . There are large portions of people who live in blacktop and cement jungles. At best small cooperative gardens can be utilized.Only when the economic engine is defeated will those at the top be forced to discuss issues on life of the ordinary workers and peasants. As long as this corporate engine motors smoothly, we will all risk annihilation.Capiltalism as it is now being enforced is like a cancer,it must be cut out to save the planet.There in lies Pelosi's problem,she is a previleged member of that class of corporate structure.

So Cindy is running as an independent right?

The sad question then is if she jumps into the race, who will be the Gore and who will be the Nader?

I think the best thing we can do now is to support the Libertarians or the Reform Party (not with votes however) until they're strong enough to split the conservatives, then push the Greens until there's 4 parties.

If only we had a Parliament.

Wonder if Bill would have won at all if not for Perot?

Rebel Farmer - for what its worth the only suggestion i can come up with is:

"be a rebel farmer or at least, be a farmer for the locality...."

Peace,
Ken Hausle
* I support Impeachment of ALL OF DC....but we should start with the top and let it trickle down as it will....

I'm still having trouble posting. Something about WordPress and MySQL....Anybody got any suggestions?

This is disappointing. I had hoped that Nancy Pelosi's experience and skill would be the tipping point for funding the war in Iraq. Not to mention disarming the Bush saber rattling with Iran.

What is so frightening about meeting with your constituents? What kind of scaredy-cat is our Speaker of the House of Representatives?

furthermore, and with no flippance (really), i say it is now 11:11.

Peace,
Ken Hausle
* time is of the essence

clarity - what you are saying may be so (or so it seems to me...), but it also seems to me that we are just talking so we don't really need any restrictions on what folks say. Say as you will, just be prepared to defend yourself --- or at least it seems like it ought to be that way to me...

Regardless, i kind of liked Zel's jab.

Peace,
Ken Hausle

Zel- "Here's to wishing Pelosi and "MtnGoat" would elope and go off somewhere"

Many voicing their opinion on this page seem frustrated as to why they can't affect greater change- I would say that history shows that to make a difference you have to engage with those you disagree with and work through the issues in a productice way. Comments equating Bush's executive power grap with Hitler are an insult to intelligent people and serve only to alienate those who make them as the Looney Left.

If the purpose of these posts is to blow off some steam and have some fun with hyperbole than by all means have at it. If however it is to have a serious discussion on how to turn our country around than the emphasis should be on sound critical thinking where those with different views are welcomed as an opporntunity to further our understanding and reslove.

WE NEED TERM LIMITS IN CONGRESS! Then and only then will we have change. Look at Kennedy, tons of democratic power, but too concerned about his legacy to help us out.

The energy that brought the Dems to power has turned to rage, but it will beat uselessly on the shores of the empire unless it becomes a concerted and focused opposition. Turns out the truth that Nader proclaimed about tweedle dee and tweedle dum applied to war, torture and mass surveillance as well as corporate control of social issues. An impeachment proceeding could have crippled this Presidency, corrected the most egregious constitutional mistakes and started the national debate that really needs to happen in the face of the fascist mentality of the new right. The current Democratic leaders want to steer the plutocracy , not challege it.

I personally think one possible effective battleground for the left is NPR. We should march on NPR stations and demand real news. We should pressure every NPR station to carry Democracy Now.

The other , as many have said, is congressional seats. Greens, Independents , hardcore anti-war Democrats.

We need to confront the media and the enthusiasm of uninformed citizens for Hillary by writing , talking, campaigning.

I am as angry about the corruption of Democracy as anyone here, but I am trying to consider what is actually possible. We need creative strategists. I would love to hear Medea, Zinn, Nader, Sheehan, Moyers etc. put forth more in the way of organizing strategies and specific goals.

The creative attack ads sponsored by Move-on were great . We need to compel the media owners to run political messages from whoever puts up the cash.

Am I crazy here? I would love some feedback on these thoughts.

shenonymous: i don't know.

i'm tired of this "lesser of two evils" thing; you still end up with something evil....plus,

i don't want to take back a party that could give a crap about me.....

Lastly, why do you refer to "CD" in the past tense? CommonDreams has been extraordinary and no reason why it can't continue to be as such (which is probably what you think also, i just thought this might be worth pointing out)......

as far as "DC" is concerned, well then, the past tense is fine with me....

Peace,
Ken Hausle
* I support Impeachment of DC

Fran is too nice. It is not that we should "ask" them to step aside, We the People will tell them they are stepping aside! It's all in the verbs and the votes. Sheehan will replace Pelosi (with our help). And the Edwards/Kucinich ticket is looking very good to me. And we need to take back the Democratic Party. To heck with new parties, it will be a Johnny-come-lately effort and the Republicans will walk away with the elections again! Or are you just too lazy to work for it? It's always the easy way out to replace something with which you are not happy with a new toy. But easy doesn't solve the problem. We need strength in numbers, not more divisiveness.

CommonDreams has been an extraordinary place to meet minds of all temperaments.

terryb 6:52 am 9/6

** after what bush and cheney have been allowed to get away with, and not to have been impeached, they might as well take it off the table forever. this sets a precedant that may never be surpassed. **

Heck, lets just burn the table. It seems to me as if there is nothing on the table except maybe all everyday US citizens and we are just getting "reamed". On the other hand, there is probably lots going on underneath the table that we have no idea about even though it so affects our welfare. This is just all out plum wrong. It ain't RIGHT.

I mean come on...it is as if we are nothing more than "mere tools" for the elite or that is what they think. Time will tell, but i feel similar to Vince Lawrence when he says...."the anger and rage are building".

Chaos by its inherent nature is uncontrollable. For those few out there thinking you are "pulling the strings" all i can say is be careful what you unleash....you probably won't get what you expect....

Ken Hausle

The achilles heel of the Democratic party is that it is so divided. The Republican party is comletely united, the ignorance of the masses if you will. The Democratic divide I believe, serves as proof that it is still a true democracy. Howard Dean has even said "the voters choose candidates for the Democratic party while the Republican party chooses its candidates for the voters". Every Republican move is carefully caluclated as Democratic minority interests run around bumping heads with each other.

My call to action to anyone who wants make a real change:

WRITE IN GORE!!! (tell your friends)

after what bush and cheney have been allowed to get away with, and not to have been impeached, they might as well take it off the table forever. this sets a precedant that may never be surpassed.

Hausle, Hi, thanks for reminding to give credit where it's due and express support for Common Dreams. They've been a great blessing through this long nightmare. You sound like a fairly righteous individual _ peace to you, too.

The Vichy comparison makes good sense _ not by promulgating the stereotype of the French being cowardly, which is certainly untrue. They at least have the balls to hit the steets when they should. The comparison serves us better by likening the Bush regime to Hitler's. It's time more people come out and say it. The only difference between Hitler's mass murder and the Bush regime's is a matter of method and number. That could change over time.

Here's to wishing Pelosi and "MtnGoat" would elope and go off somewhere.

Yet any amount of media cynicism and ridicule will only last as long as the pop culture will give attention. The underlying problems will still exist long after the jokes stop rolling on the late night programs. There will be a new target and new jokes and we all laugh. No, this place that we are in right now requires something much more than a few jokes on the Daily Show, although I would agree that it is a good feeling knowing that we live in a society that we can ridicule our so called leaders.

However, it is an uneasy feeling knowing that we are limited in our ability to hold leadership accountable aside from a joke or two. Our government is a social contract of all of us. For the people, by the people or so it has been said. So, I would argue that when we crack jokes about our government and it's conscribes, we are ultimately cracking jokes about our own social contract. It is good to be able to laugh at ourselves, but eventually the jokes end up making us shake our heads rather than entice feelings of delight. The joke is on us in the end.

Lots of good ideas. My thought is that ridicule is powerful in our pop culture. The elder President Bush began losing his public stature when TV comedians started making fun of him. The same thing has happened to President W, who couldn't get elected as dogcatcher now. Pelosi and Reid can be influenced the same way, and oh are they vulnerable to ridicule! These egomaniacs have chosen to put themselves center-stage, and they aren't going to enjoy playing clowns. My guess is that damaging their inflated egos may inflict more pain on them than any amount of under-the-table money can compensate.

thedeed: where to start? Like you (?) tried very hard to work inside the system. Went to meet-ups for Dean and came away feeling slimed by political hacks and hangers-on. For a brief time tried persuading perrenial non-voters to register and vote. The typical response I got went something like this: "Do I have SUCKER tattood on my forehead? Get out of my face fool!"

Marched in Washington the January before the invasion and then waited for the news coverage of the half-million of us that went to say NO! ... and waited, and waited...

In this backwater rust-belt hollow was one of the lone voices writing letters to the local paper exposing the lies of BushCo. Last letter I wrote was a very effective appeal to throw the bums out last November. And it seems we (the 70% majority wanting change) did our part. Now, seeing that we've been fooled again, am too ashamed to write any more such letters.

I've sung along for many years to The Who but this time I really won't be fooled again. It is no longer possible to affect (progressive) change through the political process here in America. Every non-status quo voice is silenced, ignored, or ridiculed. Even if we were to commit ourselves to the truth you expressed it would take years to enact any substantive change to the corporatocracy. WE DO NOT HAVE THE LUXURY OF TIME.

Only a collapse will now advance change, so maybe it is our duty to hasten the collapse. This is not a rant, and it is a conclusion that I detest and abhor, but no matter what calculus or angle of attack I apply to our problems it is the only conclusion that remains standing.

Oh Vince, be patient, it takes time. We no longer have that luxury. And it takes more than time. It takes an honest-to-god majority of very angry citizens to realize just how far up shit creek we are without a paddle. Only a collapse will accomplish that.

an aside: anyone care to wager just what percentage of DLC money will be committed to defending Peloshit's seat? Genius Cindy!

Too bad for the women of the nation. It looked for a while that they had a chance to show what one of their gender could do to right this tragedy but Pelosi flunked the test. Now what are we to think about the already-chosen Hilary? We need people like Cindy Sheehan and Kucinich who know what they stand for and are not afraid to stick with it. The maniacs in the white house may start WWIII though and then none of it will matter anymore, so don`t worry, be happy!!

When I read MR. Pelosi attended the Bohemian Grove bash this summer ... Bush, Kissinger, etc., I wondered ... what was he doing there?

We Progressives, Peaceniks, old-time Democrats that really fought for the people ... we've been sold out, that's all.

Edwards and Kuchinich should combine forces and money and start running together for PREZ and VEEP and declare a new party ... maybe, simply, if there isn't one by that name, THE PEOPLE'S PARTY ...

Couldn't find a more appropriate thread:

Does anyone know what this is all about?

http://www.motherjones.com/news/feature/2007/09/hillarys-prayer.html

Just in case that address reflects my lousy typing too well. It's an article in the recent issue of Mother Jones called "Hillary's Prayer."

Re:r06ue1 September 5th, 2007 4:53 pm
and: Favonian September 5th, 2007 6:50 pm

I'm in agreement with you. WeThePeople need to ask these leaders to step aside and let someone who is with the majority of Americans now vote the troops home without delay.
I suspect a great silent majority is with the marchers on Sep 15th and cannot for whatever reason, participate. So we have a way anyone who supports them can do their part easily and cheaply.

Please check out www.wethepeopleforpeace.org and sign the people's declaration of independence. If nothing else, it gives them permission to get out of town while the getting's good and no need to wait for the election schedule. How about it? One small step for our country..
Fran

These says the question isn't whether you're you paranoid. Its whether you're paranoid enough?

Looks like I arrived late to the party. And what a party.

Vichy Democrats. Well yeah, we do have them. Unfortunately they're the ones in power. That's what the Vichy French were, the ones in power. Collaborators.

And then there's good ole MtnGoat blaming the Iranians for the mess in Iraq. What the Bush administration isn't talking about is that the Saudis have been assisting the Sunnis. What we've started is a regional conflict by destabilizing Iraq. We did it.

Back to Nancy. Bless her heart, loading the gun that will finish off her run for the House. Screaming at antiwar activists who want to talk to her and calling them nuts. In San Francisco! Bet that goes over big.

Okay. Polls say 70% of Americans want to stop the war and bring the troops home. But Pelosi and other blue dog Dems won't let it happen. They evidently believe the polls are misleading. They believe that if they moved to end the war, they wouldn't get reelected. They believe their constituents want the war to continue. They're not afraid of getting thrown out of office in 2008.

Pelosi evidently believes that it's more important to her future political career to do the bidding of large contributors. Why? Because it takes large amounts of money to run TV ads, and I guess there's still a substantial majority of Americans that rely on the MSM, and are reliably influenced at election time.

Add to that the continuing addiction of Americans across the political spectrum to petroleum products. There's certainly no boycott underway, is there? And so, although Americans, when asked by pollsters if they want the Iraq war to end, give the fashionable reply, deep down they know they want the establishment to control that oil. At least that's the feeling I get when I see the road to the beach heavy with SUVs on the weekend. Is this just me?

I don't agree with those who claim the cyberspace is less important than the streets.

The internet is where the war of propaganda is fought.

It is a very critical part of the fight.

C'mon folks. Venting spleen here is a sanity saver for many, sure.

but it's only cyberspace onanism if we won't at least follow through with measureable support for more direct forms of action that other people ARE taking.

Protest marches and other actions are now being organized across the country (check-out various anti-Bush, pro-peace, pro-Constitution websites, to see where.)

Most of us here can't be physically present at these real time prostests - for perfectly valid reasons. But we oughta do the next best thing (for now): At least support the marches and events by giving their organizers as much direct financial, political, and emotional support as we can.

If more of us can't do this, then progressive websites like this actually function to the enemy's advantage: they draw-off vital human energy and legitimate anger into a rat hole that has barely-marginal flesh and blood consequences.

The power holders who are ruining this country and this world need to see and feel us IN PERSON. Or the next best thing: Our direct material support for people who do get physical in opposing them.

I don't doubt that with enough organization and material support, we could see Pelosi's own grandkids marching in San Francisco against her implicit claim that she's "doing the best she can."

(One of her grandson's has already joined an Impeach Bush org, in the Bay area)

Sundrily:

1. MtnGoat eats, drinks and sleeps imperialist ideology (be it neoliberal economics or right-wing foreign policy). I, too, have observed his hackneyed ramblings and his limping logic, not to mention his half-baked syntax and bad orthography.

2. On a totally different note, I agree totally with vangelaras (see above): Cindy Sheehan does put the fear into all o' them liberal and progressive "personalities," and into all o' them Demopublicans. Cindy, you are red sun in my heart!

Ken Hausle September 5th, 2007 3:25 pm

Common Dreams provides a valueable service, but the site "commondreams" has their own interests. I've been saying this for awhile and putting out some suggestions…

EECK! What do you mean? You just made me shit my pants, like I'm being bugged

Please tell me otherwise, I like this site.

Pelosi is the daughter of an old Baltimore political hack, Tommy D'Alessandro, who was wired into the power structure back in the day as well.

Cindy for Congress! Kick Pelosi out on her militarist, pro-Bush arse!

I emailed Madame Pelosi yesterday, informing her of our utter disappointment with their performance so far. As I reminded her, they got our support with campaign promises and tough talk about standing up to Bush's bullying tactics. I also reminded her that she had acknowledged publicly that the reason the Democrats won control of both houses was because the voters used the election as a referendum on the war.

The only rationale that I can imagine is the terrible scenario that this Congress is using the lives of our troops as bargaining chips to get other bills through. (minimum wage, add-on amendments, etc.)

I assured her that, in my eyes, there is no issue so important that it should be paid for in additional American blood.

I am so tired of begging to those who will never ever listen to us.

It's time to stop begging.

Go Cindy Go!

Great work, Medea, my CODEPINK sister. THANKS!!!! I'll see you in DC on September 15th!

To peace,
Linda

Hilary: the east coast AIPAC girl

Nancy: the west coast AIPAC girl

What a pair we have!

One acronym, AIPAC explains it all.

AIPAC rules the government of the United States of America. You will find that almost all the candidates in every major election are under this power. Aquaint yourself with it and support only candidates that distance themself from thier influence.

Recommended reading: The Israel Lobby and U.S. Foreign Policy by J. Mearsheimer and S. Walt, 2007.

MtnGt said

"Iran shells Iraq, and trains and arms terrorists to kill US soldiers."

Who told you this? Fox Noise? Seriously, where is your link to proof of this? We arm and train terrorists ourselves so even if proof could be provided to such end, SO WHAT? We are illegally occupying a Sovereign nation, why wouldn't Iran be worried about our close proximity to THEIR borders? Not to mention the sabre rattling neanderthals currently running the show. So tired of buffoons...

I think Nancy Pelosi does an excellent job of clearly illustrating how untrustworthy and corrupt the national leadership of the Democratic Party has become.

MtnGoat,

With your last comment ("Iran shells Iraq, and trains and arms terrorists to kill US soldiers") you proved beyond any possible doubt that there is absolutely no reason for anyone here to read your posts. Some of us were under the mistaken impression that you might be some Ron Paul-supporting libertarian, with at least reasonable views on foreign policy, but now you have demonstrated for all that you are a serious KoolAid addict (or should it be "KookAid"?). Sorry, but that is the way it is.

hey Vince Lawrence, i doubt it.

I don't think anger and rage can be "calculated". Too chaotic.

Peace,
Ken Hausle

I know Ms. Benjamin was trying to write in a diplomatic and non-confrontational tone, but I suspect that Peloshit will be rolling on the floor reading Ms. Benjamin's appeal to listen to her "base." Earthian (12:10) nailed it: she is listening to and serving her base, the one base, the only base. "I will never meet with you!" (you are all)"Nuts!"

My anger and my rage are about to master me, and I suspect this too has been calculated in advance.

i agree: Give the Common Dreams site a break.....but then......

where do we go from here.......

i think it needs to be much more about PLACE.....because

....regardless of the imaginary "heaven" in the minds of a few....

the place we live and those around are what matters most to which we ought be true.....

Peace to U,
Ken Hausle

"and is sickened by the very real prospect of another unilateral and unprovoked attack, this time against Iran."

Unprovoked and unilateral? Iran shells Iraq, and trains and arms terrorists to kill US soldiers.

ever go to the Nation threads?

spammers, libertarian fanatics, rightwing trolls, DLC bullies....It is near impossible to even carry on a thoughtful exchange with so many seeking to sabotage the process. I have had a few posts zapped here too. But it is glitchy software I suspect because others have also had the experience for no overwhelming reason.
It is worth it--don't take it personally--it is not censorship as much as having the freedom without threat gestapos goosestepping over everything.

To: bongofury (12:41P) & hazmat (1:51P)...

Confirming your statement, Hazmat, refer to archived C-D article recently. Go to www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/08/25/3411/ and read about police procedures that help shape negative image, in the public's eye, of legitimate non-violent protest and demonstration.

Bongofury, take Hazmat's advice and beware of those that tempt you into violent action. Walk away, quickly, and stay away.

Common Dreams provides a valueable service, but the site "commondreams" has their own interests. I've been saying this for awhile and putting out some suggestions...

Nevertheless, i appreciate Common Dreams and the opportunity it provides..where would we be without these dreams.....

Peace,
Ken Hausle

vangelaras--

Usually posts disappear automatically until an editor can look at them if they have certain swear words, "hot" words (racial slurs, etc.), or excessive amounts of links. I'm sure there are plenty of other reasons one's post might be [temporarily] removed.

I don't think most people realize yet that both parties are the SAME! They are both elitist rich people (with a few exceptions in both parties) that believe in elite rule, not majority rule or even representing the people which is what they were elected to do in the first place.

Until We The People replace our goverment with one that is truly representative (or even better a True Democracy) we will continue to have ELITE RULE.

Its too late for peaceful change but still too early to line the bastards up against a wall and shoot them. That time is approaching though. And it is the only way to change things.

I had posted a brief note to Cindy Sheehan about ten minutes ago and it has disappeared Why?

I was telling Cindy that she is the true leader from,by and for the people and the reason that she is given "friendly" advice by "liberal" and "progressive" personalities and publications to change her mind about campaigning against Pelosi is that they are afraid of Cindy. They know that the vision of Cindy for a world of peace, love and justice reflects the desires of the majority of the American people. And they know that such a vision by an independent candidate migh be the beginning of the
dismanteling of their corrupt and deadly "two"
party status quo. So Go Cindy, Go and we are with you.

I ask again the editor of these posts: WHY DID MY EARLIER POST DISAPPEAR ?

Many conservatives used to be liberals until Mammon took them.

Right on! Alex. The short-sighted children of privilege have ruined and will continue to destroy this nation. They believe that you and I should fight with others for the benefit of themselves; already having too much money to be useful citizens.

Go Cindy, Go kick the AIPAC girl' butt.

The decadent DUMOS have become a moral menace infected with rancid dreams and retarded rodent chromosomes never hearing the hideous call of death screaming over lost desert battlefields of depleted uranium mutations that hail from a dark and bloody ground of cash inspired madness and human depravity.

re: Vichy France

They not only collaborated with the Nazis but with the Imperial Japanese as well. When the Japanese army moved into Indochina the French there did nothing that would imperil their own well-being.

Pelosi is just another System Slut.

Get rid of her.

re bongofury 12:41pm

there's no need for us to start a riot, as there will be plenty of agents provocateur assigned to that task.

for safety's sake, assume that anybody who suggests violent confrontation is a cop and move quickly away from him or her.

thank-you rebelnow that clarifies it a bit for me...

Peace,
Ken Hausle

Ken, I'm assuming he is referring to the traitorous Vichy governmnent in France during WW2. They collaborated with the Nazi's and betrayed their own people.
So george bush (the poster) very clever and accurate.

i mean i know i cant make u shut up, but....

do you know anything about the vichy....

you call out the name of many who 2 the best of my knowledge sacrificed their safety on behalf of principle, but i'll admit i do not know the whole story..who does because its always changing..the point is you are suggesting some sort of innuendo....but who knows what you really mean, and that is not good communication....

As far as i'm concerned, principles matter and so does scale...
and for heaven's sake so does empathy.....crazy that this even needs to be said.....maybe i need to shut up myself...

Peace,
Ken Hausle

hey george fucking bush (the person posting here...)

Define vichy democrats or shut the hell up.....

Jack37, follow the money to AIPAC. They want nothing to do with troop withdrawal and are supporting the current saber rattling with Iran. Money always rules these spineless cowards and all our ranting and raving falls on deaf ears.

That is if we assume that the two parties are really two parties and not just one with two different names to fool.

I wouldn't advise anyone to listen to Karl Rove. Look what happened to Bush as he did listen.

I am so happy so many of you think the Vichy Democrats are going to save you.

Lets stop talking to our lying, corporate elected representatives; there is only one course of action...speak to them in a language they understand.

Get active locally and replace Pelosi and all similar democrats with people like Cindy Sheehan

Nancy Pelosi should listen to her conscience.

That is,___ if she still has one.

Oh people. The inherent falacy is continually trying to make Pelosi part of the solution. SHE IS NOT! She is firmly part of the problem. She is part and parcel of the Corporate Democrats, Rethuglican Lite. Pelosi will do nothing for the good of the people that the corporate paymasters haven't sanctioned. And the corporate paymasters want war. As the blood flows, so do the monies to their coffers. I say to you, quite trying to put lipstick--and a peace sign--on a pig. Neither changes the reality.

It is PAINFULLY CLEAR that Congress--Democrap majority or Rethuglican majority--has a higher allegience than to the American people. Our votes are just a rubber stamp on the process. Congress does not worship at the altar of Democracy, it worships at the feet of Mammon. And our children are just blood sacrifice.

The apologetic language to these Democratic hacks gets tiresome here. If Pelosi had not backstabbed the 2006 voters, Bush would be well on his way out the Oval Office door now, and Cheney would probably already be gone.

And I have something else to say: If Bush and Cheney start a war in Iran, the blood of thousands of innocents will be on Pelosi's hands. It is she, and no one else, who will be responsible for the next bloodletting.

Ken Hausle,

Yes, I know a bit about gm's many shenanigans, but too off-topic to go into here. Sorry about inadvertently hitting your hot button issue.