Its so surprising to see supposedly educated people act like pompous juveniles when their bias view of things are debunked. No I havent seen your "11th hour" film. Nor have I seen algore's film. I have read the transcripts on algore's film and seen the statistics he uses. In case you have forgotten, algore's film, his methodology, his statistics have all been debunked. Recently, esteemed scientists in peer reviewed reports have debunked the primary bugaboo in the " man induced global warming" fantasy that temperatures used by the models are useless, and the models themselves cant make any definitive assertians. Facts are mankind has no affect on global temperatures. We are warming, but simply because we are still in the warming period btwn glacial epochs. Its NATURAL. We only have to adapt to it instead of trying to affect a global system that wont be affected. This is only to bring down the economic might of the US. Its socialism/communism in disguise.

Climate Deniers = Climate Dodos

"The Dodo (Raphus cucullatus) was a flightless bird that lived on the islands of Mauritius. Related to pigeons and doves, it stood about a meter tall (three feet), lived on fruit and nested on the ground.

"The dodo has been extinct since the mid-to-late 17th century. It is commonly used as the archetype of an extinct species because its extinction occurred during recorded human history, and was directly attributable to human activity. The phrase "as dead as a dodo" means undoubtedly and unquestionably dead." -- Wikepedia

One dinosaur to another, 1,000,000 years ago.

"dont worry, this ice age is NATURAL"

S321Saint,

Your satire is too close to the edge. Because there are so many hopelessly uneducated and bamboozled rubes in our society, sometimes it is better to stay away from that edge lest others mistake you for a complete idiot.

I find it interesting that environmentalism is now more in the mainstream, now that we have had a President that is so, how would you say... non environmental.

If right wing Christian politics can bring together voters, then I suppose that environmentalism could as well. Whenever people have common purpose, they can overlook their differences.

S3211Saint....so you haven't seen either film, but only accepted the propoganda from the "esteemed" pet corporate "scientists".."esteemed" by the corporate set, no doubt, and published in their own corporate owned papers.

man, you deserve to go extinct.

Man, you'all are crackin' me up! It's great to see so many with a sense of humor on these dark pages of the left.

I'm looking forward to seeing The 11th Hour in Minneapolis on August 31st.

We humans need to learn to live consistent with and in harmony with the long-term health of the natural world in which we are a part. Any economic system which cannot support this is not ultimately functional or viable.

I'm afraid that we'll just have to accept the fact that the American populace has been so dumbed down in the past 50 years that it's hopeless to expect to educate them to the extent that they can overcome the pervasive brainwashing of the mass media. Given that, when push comes to shove, resource wars are inevitable. That is, in fact, what the mess in Iraq is all about and what the next war in Iran will be about. Both parties, being essentially indistinguishable from each other, as Coke is to Pepsi, are already committed to Israel and the inevitable occupation of the Middle East. It won't take much to get the vast majority of the American public on board. Just make them believe that their security is threatened and they'll be ready to nuke the world if it means saving the American way of life.

The great challenge ahead of us, beyond the climate apocalypse, is to try to prevent these wars from going nuclear. Otherwise, all bets are off.

Dear S321Saint:

If you haven't seen Al Gore's film, then you haven't seen its most striking graph. This timeline depicts periods of natural global warming using ice core samples going back 600,000 years. The periods of natural global warming appear on the graph as neat little red triangles. However, when we approach the present day there is no little red triangle but rather a steep, climbing jagged cliff, the beginning of which happens to coincide exactly with the beginning of the industrial revolution. Of course, there may also be a little red triangle hiding in there somewhere!

I really do feel that people who comment on the movie without even having seen it have zero credibility!

Al Gore makes a good point right at the beginning of the film about the thinness of the Earth's atmosphere. Having once been to an altitude of 17,700 feet I was struck at the time with this fact. Finding it hard to breathe does make one think about the atmosphere! All the various things that we have been sending up into the atmosphere, together with our destruction of living entities on the planet which produced the atmosphere in the first place, must surely have some effect. Mess it up and expect unpleasant consequences!

Saint August - You are as wrong as a person can be. Open your mind to real evidence from thousands of scientists, understand how concretely solid the proven facts really are. Forget those alleged 'conspiracies' - you've been brainwashed. Watch the Gore film, read the published science, and think deeply about what is true, real and of value.

Be humble before real scientists, if you aren't one. Be content to state that you are aware of your own ignorance, and want to overcome it. Don't indulge the perversion of truth by wilfully believing in imagined bugaboos and supposed debunkings.

Otherwise you do the equivalent of denying you own mortality. Just like one day you will die and so will I, so our planet faces inevitable, huge, transforming spasms, through the course of which the very unpredictability of the changes that occur, will be pretty much the only thing that stays constant around us.

Non-communist and non-socialist scientists in their thousands across the globe, are measuring real changes that are way beyond any natural forcing of climate systems. Their models are now effective when hindcasting previous climates, and are becoming increasingly precise in future projections.

All mainstream scientific information about climate change, including analyses of recent events such as this summer's UK and Asian flooding, the Mediterranean/Eastern Europe heat wave, the dramatic July 2007 low-point in the extent of Arctic sea-ice, are entirely consistent with a huge evidence base that establishes - unequivocally - that extreme climate events are now happening with greater intensity and higher frequency than in the past. Unexpected events and unprecedented variability are becoming usual. The averages themselves are changing. Just ask the British families coping with floods in Hull and Tewksbury; the citizens of Athens, and this year's millions of Asians made homeless.

Meanwhile, some bubbles of froth were created by a recent - ridiculously minor - correction of the US 20th century temperature record, causing momentary jubilation amongst the climate change deniers, who yet again demonstrate how they grasp at any straw to defend the indefensible.

Those of us who survive the coming couple of decades, we will all look back at the idiocy of corporate-sponsored denial, the way many young Germans today view the years leading to WW2 - with deep shame, a sense that back then we had gone collectively mad, were blinkered to the obvious.

I am not alone in predicting that the name 'George Bush #2' will in the future be cursed with as much deep rancour as 'Hitler' has been for the last 70 years, standing as he will for a period of crass war-mongering and environmental despoliation, representing as he does the choice to remain wilfully ignorant even when faced by vast oceans of evidence.

With his cohort, Bush will be decried for deliberately fomenting doubt, just the way a family cries in complaint against the tobacco-peddlers during the last moments at the bedside of a cancer-ridden smoker. Along with his band of neo-con and corporate backers, there's no doubt he will be despised for generation after generation through the coming centuries.

Our collective future is bleak indeed. We are carrying out a planetary destructive experiment, in which generations alive today will establish that, by continuing our careless collective burning of forests and fossil fuels, we are fully capable of ending the social and economic prosperity that we in the developed world have enjoyed over the idyll of the last few decades.

That will be a terrible legacy for our children. They will look back at these current times as an impossible-to-imagine period of stability and plenty.

I would dearly like to live out the rest of my years knowing that there will be a planet available to sustain our race, with humanity living alongside the rest of the global biota in some kind of balance.

But very little is really happening to flatten out our carbon emissions and bring us hope of a prosperous future. We are incredibly far off-track from applying a genuine, evidence-based, collective response, which would work in time to reduce the chances of spiralling into ever-wider catastrophes.

The trends that industrial societies are following are the entire opposite of planetary requirement - as shown for example by the recent US National Acadamy of Science study that demonstrated how CO2 emissions are creeping well above even the pessimistic IPCC levels for business-as-usual.

Then there is the 2002/3 Mauna Loa CO2 anomaly, when the carbon added into the atmosphere was greatly above the previous decade- average, which is widely considered the likely harbinger of a sustained increase in our rate of carbon deposit into the atmosphere, bringing with it likelier and earlier onsets of feedbacks and tip-overs in key planetary systems.

Many scientists I speak with are now so highly alarmed that only their customary reticence stops them tearing their hair out and running naked down the streets....

To avoid catastrophe in coming decades - including the worsening suffering of millions in the tropics - we have to radically change the way we in industrialised countries go about our daily lives, and how international development is effected. Progress in reducing emissions depends upon the joint exercise of the choice to consume far less of the planets resources.

We must overcome collective blindness and denial of the dangerous and threatening impacts that our ways of life are causing our planet. At present almost everyone - individuals, companies, nations - is simply inclined to preserve their own little niche of collective consumption, for their own personal advantage.

Action taken so far to combat climate change is ludicrously far off track from solving the root causes – actually flattening out how much carbon is added to and retained within the atmosphere. Kyoto and the EU Emission Trading system are just tiny straws in fields of haystacks.

To prevent dangerous climatic destabilization all credible advice shows that the UK for example – working rapidly in concert with all other major emitters - must reduce emissions by 60-80 % below 1990 levels within the next 20 years.

The majority still just refuse to believe those risks are real, acting as if they simply do not wish to be informed – we have decided to stay stupid.

Modern civilisation blindly heads towards catastrophe, fuelled by market failure, absent leadership, lack of foresight and grossly-deficient societal decision-making.

If we don't and can't act, as global average temperatures rise more than 2C above pre-industrial levels, many processes are bound to enter the feared positive feedbacks. Initial climate change will beget more climate change, just as when the planet warmed up and emerged from earlier ice ages.

Only this time – as we are already in an interglacial period - global heating will speed out of any control. Our year-on-year rate of addition of CO2 into the atmosphere is already 200 times faster than has ever occurred over recent natural cycles.

For the first time in history, every population, culture, ethnic group and region faces a future that threatens one and all, unless we develop a planetary response that engages all sectors, governments and societies to quickly control petrochemical dependence and greatly reduce the footprint of all human activity.

I believe that it we don't face up to the challenge, within 10 to 15 years we will face an unravelling of economic systems, a rapid decline in our ability to supply basic needs and significant decay in the quality of our lives. Beyond 20 years, most likely what we will bequeath our children are terribly hard and desperate lives.

It's as if we had been told by our family doctor that we only have so long to live - we will die of a fatal disease in a matter of a few years.

And the doctor has told everyone around us, the same bad news on the same day, informing us that our demise will be collective and is almost unavoidable, that we were likely to die off alongside our progeny, losing touch in our last dying years with much of what we hold to be of value.....

To die ourselves, as our planet's systems break down, knowing that our grandchildren won't survive to have anything like the lives of quality and length that we have enjoyed, will be miserable indeed.

Don't know if anyone noticed, but we just had a hurricane in Oklahoma on Sunday. (That of course, is impossible!)Seems fitting somehow that it hit the State with the idiot 'global warming is a myth' Senator. Inhofe has been strangely absent.

No one with a brain can stand him. The right wing nuts and the oil companies that keep him in office, unfortunately are the majority here.

You would think the fundies would get it, a HURRICANE in Oklahoma. Nope. They think God saved them.
If the weather from the north had been a few degrees cooler, it would have been the most massive tornado, ever. Nothing of the center of the state would be left.

Ah, thank God it was warmer. It saved us from that much worse tornado. Don't you love logic?

Let's all pretend there's no such thing greed, and that humans also have a history of "waking up" before it's too late.

Or, we can deal with real reality: greed is not only epidemic, and promoted daily, it's such a debilitating mental illness it causes total denial of the facts in front of one's face. The rich are working harder than ever to be super-richer, not to "save the planet," and the rest of "the people" are sick of watching the easy life and want a piece for themselves, damn the rest to hell, even if it's fleeting. Until greed becomes treatable, all the best intentions and "hope for the future" are a waste of time, unless one believes that, for the first time in history, mass enlightenment will occur before the dominoes start to fall.

Over 40% still believe Saddam was the 9/11 mastermind and that evolution is an anti-God liberal warcry. Enlighten that!

Saving the planet
by the Master —, through Benjamin Creme
www.share-international.org

"When mankind realizes how serious is the ecological imbalance of their planetary home, they must take the steps so urgently needed to remedy the situation. If men were to fail to respond with sufficient resolution they would be guilty of surrendering the planet to slow but inevitable destruction. What, then, the legacy to hand on to their children? That this self-destruction should not prevail all must act together, and make the necessary sacrifices. This will entail a complete change in attitude to the integrity of the planet and what are seen as the needs of men today.
It will not be easy for some to countenance the changes needed but only by such change can the life of the planet be assured. Already, deep inroads have been made into the essential stock of trees on Earth. De-forestation has caused a growing loss of oxygen and the rise of carbon gases. This is now at a critical stage and requires immediate action.

Dawning

The reality of global warming is now dawning on the minds of millions, yet, despite the overwhelming evidence some still deny that the actions of men are the cause.
We, your Elder Brothers, can say with full conviction that the actions of men are responsible for eighty per cent of global warming.
Maitreya, you will find, will not be long in bringing this urgent problem to man's attention. He will face men with the alternatives: the beneficial results of action now, on the one hand, and the destruction which would ensue from doing nothing, or too little, on the other. Thus, the decision is man's alone.

Rally

When men understand this they will indeed rally to the cause. They will see that the future for their children depends on action now, and will elicit from Maitreya and His group the necessary steps to take. Maitreya will advocate a simpler form of living, one more in keeping with the reality of the planet's situation. When enough people are convinced that this is necessary there will be a growing movement to simplify throughout the planet. This will proceed with quite unusual speed, so inspired by the need for change will millions be. Thus will the gravest dangers facing planet Earth be somewhat countered. This will encourage many and boost their readiness for further changes.
Faced with the dilemma of necessary change men will come to realize the inevitability of accepting the principle of sharing. Only sharing will make these changes practical and possible. Only through sharing can the bounty of Planet Earth be successfully used. Only through sharing can this bounty be correctly husbanded. Only thus can the Planet itself live in harmony with its environment and with its inhabitants."

I've seen the movie and it is pretty persuasive - he lines up about 50 experts (I work at a university that specializes in sustainability, and the director of that unit said there are about 12 people in this movie who are probably the smartest people in the world on this stuff). It talks about the global warming, resource pressures, deforestation, decimation of our oceans, massive amounts of waste, massive amounts of consumption, cultural barriers, the spiritual crisis, population explosion, political barriers, corporate "control" of the world's resources and political processes. The choir will walk away vindicated and energized, while those who maybe weren't too sure about it (if they manage to sit through the whole thing) will at the very least get it that it is extremely important and urgent, and will hopefully get out of the way of those who are mobilized to do something about it. It is a very serious movie - about as un-hollywood and talking head as you can get. I hope this will have a huge impact -- although it just may make people feel like it is too late and there is no way to turn this train around before it is too late. It points out repeatedly that any significant social change has taken 30 years to achieve in this country - and we don't have 30 years.

pacplyer:
nah--i think a lot of us imagined the notion
myself
i would like to see
a drawing of sticks..
yrs ago i would have done this
i think
you been cut??
i at 25
ken

Don't state that the climate is changing to Republicans or Fundamentalist Christians face to face. They will not believe you.

The odds of neocons suddenly seeing the light are remote imho. They have built up their entire belief system around a doomsday second coming. It's as if they want a tribulation and mass extinction just to vindicate their self-fullfilling prophecies.

Even if we shut off every CO2 producing source it may already be too late. Enough heat energy has been released already to finish off the sea ice/glaciers. Loss of reflectivity is self-exciting the process. Studies that calculate we have 100 years till sea levels rise 20 feet do not take into consideration the massive acceleration of glaciers towards the sea we now see now that the sea ice is dwindling at unbeleivable rates.

No one wants to talk about the only thing that can save the planet: population control! To me the environmentalists are as unrealistic as the neocons on this obvious issue. Cars and airplanes are only part of the problem. Right now, the huge island of Sumatra is going up in smoke as a massive population of peasants try to clear the jungle for farmland to feed their children. A wave of these people are crossing into Borneo and doing the same thing to the last large rain forest in Asia. The smoke is called "the haze" and is blanketing neighboring countries.

Nobody, I mean not even anybody on this website has the courage to utter the obvious solution we all at some point have to embrace: Homo Sapian mass sterization!

And you thought you were progressive?

pacplyer - out

Anyone interested in learning that we can live well and at current levels without producing climate-changing gases or cancer-inducing toxins? Look at the work of William McDonough. Search him on YouTube and see the light.

It's not about polluting less, it's about designing systems that not only don't pollute but better the environment.

This isn't theory, his firm is already doing it.

As for "Save the Planet" I say WAKE UP! The planet will be just fine. Our global warming is the briefest of slight fevers as far as Gaia is concerned. Hell, remember the mass extinction and environmental disaster caused 65 million years ago by an asteroid slamming into the Yucatan?

No? Well, neither does Gaia!

Our civilization, however, may not be so lucky...

S321 Saint,

I feel sorry for you...but sorrier for anyone you influence with your obvious but twisted intelligence.

We have friends who are Evangelical Christians. If we broach the subject of global warmng, or pollutions from burning coal or the dangers of using DU and how it will effect their children and grand children, they don't wish to hear it. Their ususl respnse is, there is nothing we can do about those things, our children will be in heaven. Just leave it to God and trust in Jesus, he's in charge.

Well, maybe Jesus is in charge. Whenever Bush appears on the TV news, my wife quietly mutters,___"Jesus Christ, there he is again".

I wish Jesus was in charge. I find it strange, that they are so immune to the facts and yet will insure their kids wear seatbelts in their car, wear life jackets if they go boating, and have a loaded shotgun ready for home defense.__ Why bother? I believe that is what is known as a double standard. Sometimes Jesus isn't around I suppose.

KTHX! Texas is ALLLLLLLLLL yours. Look for me in Oregon!

"Sometimes Jesus isn't around I suppose."

"...of righteousness, because I go to the father, and ye see me no more..."

Those who still debunk the consensus of the non political & dedicated international scientific community (such as S321 Saint 8/21 2:03PM comment) join Bush right wing's war on science, & our planet. Rather than pursuing even modest effort to understand the effects and consequences of mans activities they follow the misleading and even deceptive data issued by the right wing and energy cartel.

Evidence linking carbon pollution to warming has long been as close to certain as science can be. Its causes, consequences, and mitigation requirements have been documented by many dedicated environmental organizations including The Union of Concerned Scientists.

The dangerous manipulation of essential scientific data used by Bush's team to conceal and derail corrective measures for this threat and other vital environmental reforms has always been apparent--and all indicators show no change in their direction.

Often overlooked is the fact that the same measures needed to mitigate global warming would be necessary even if it were not an issue. Conservation, alternative energy development, anti- pollution refinements, etc are essential for other vital environmental reforms such as air and water quality, reductions in toxic waste generation, land preservation, etc.

Contrary to right wing assertions, greenhouse gas reduction measures could only improve our economy by lessening our trade deficits, and improving our security by reducing our dependance on foreign oil. We could also regain some of our lost world respect resulting from our opposition Kyoto while arrogantly contributing disproportionally to carbon pollution.

The immeasurable environmental and social destruction from our indifference to carbon pollution and related environmental measures can only worsen if we allow this reckless and unlearned president, guided by special interests to continue their war on our planet.

And you regressives posting here - I dare you to actually see these movies and dispute what these scientists are saying. The ones who you listen to who say otherwise are a bunch of paid-off hacks (see www.commondreams.org/headlines07/0202-05.htm )or christian fundamentalists.

pacplyer-- You made an interesting observation about the causes of global warming, the burning of forests in Sumatra and Borneo to plant food for their people. Is anyone in the USA ready to park their stable of cars, suv`s, and pickups so that we can sell our corn to these and other people who need food, and quit burning food in all of those gas guzzlers?
Oh, that`s right, there is big money to be made in ethenol for some of our large corporations, so forget that idea.

KEM PATRICK-- I loved your wife`s comment when GWB comes on TV
"Jesus Christ,there he is again"!! There is nothing like mixing up politics and religion to screw everything up.

$aint- One of Bush'$ paid Global Warming denouncer$.

$aint(notice the religious association) you were quick, first one posting. This will earn you more money as a lobbyist for the DEVIL- Bush.

pacplyer!!!! I have the balls to say your idea is great, but it's just not practical. I'm going to have to go with greed as the MAIN problem; and this doesn't necessarily mean we don't agree. OUR problem, is how are we going to get all those dumb-fucks from having so many babies? suggestions? Here's an idea!! Let's have more main-stream media promoting happiness without children.

We currently consume over 20 million barrels of oil a day in the USA. Plus tons of coal, natural gas, propane etc.

All over the earth forests are cut down releasing the carbon store in the vegetation.

Any knot head who thinks all this extra CO2 in the atmosphere has no effect is as stupid as the morons that believed agent orange was safe for humans even though it could rapidly defoliate the Vietnamese jungle.

It is clear that much of this CO2 is released to no productive end. Any American vehicle could burn 25 to 50% less fuel with current technology. Many electrical appliances consume energy any time they are plugged in whether they are on or not. etc. etc.

The utter lack of movement on reasonable steps that could reduce energy consumption for lower cost (if nothing else) stuns me. As a nation we appear to be proud we can waste resources.

In light of the evidence of rapidly accelerating global warming, we are faced with the need to do something to change the way that we have always done things before. Ever try to go on a diet? Did it work? Tens of millions go on diets all the time. The really determined few manage to make some of them work, the overwhelming majority fail to lose weight. Try stopping smoking (particularly apt in this context). Changing habitual behavior is hard even when you really want to. It is next to impossible when you deny even the need to change.

Sometimes it seems we are like a fat guy who is told that he needs to go on a diet but his work site is right next door to a bakery and the delicious aroma drives him crazy everyday. His loving wife fills his lunch box with raw carrots, salad and a hard boiled egg. Lord have mercy!

I guess we are just starting to realize just how destructive our 'Me first' - 'greed is good' philosophy has become, when it is multiplied by 6.5 billion adherents, doing it all together and all at once. Me first by definition, puts everything and everybody else second. We can't seem to wean ourselves from this engrained outlook. One that is so accepted that it even has become institutionalized - a corporation is somehow excused from ethical responsibility because it has a profits first... 'Profits uber alles'... perspective.

The mentality of deniers of global warming and our ravaged environment however ...are more like an anorexic. No one can tell an anorexic that she is beginning starve and is fast using up her body's last reserves until inevitable organ failure will result. People can't understand why any anorexic doesn't see the mordant thinness in the mirror and 'wake up'. Yet despite facts like a skeletal appearance and abnormal low weight when she steps on a scale, the anorexic sees herself as fat till the end.

Just one more point. The first poster mentioned invalidated temperature figures. the fact is that Nasa did correct the figures for one year's temperatures for the USA ...ONLY. One year out of the hottest ten actually occured in 1934 (remember this is only for temperatures in the continental USA not for the whole world which remained unchanged). The correction? By 1/100 of a percent. Yet look at how the poster twisted and exaggerated that to mean something else. Such is denial.

Gaia is becoming an anorexic and asks "Does this dress make me look fat?". Those who love her weep to hear it.

Meanwhile... the fat guy's lame excuse is "Donuts followed me home. What could I do?"

My marine biology prof in 1973 said, "The effects of global warming take place 20-50 years after the fact. If we stopped all pollution today, we'd see major decline for 20-50 years before things began to improve." Bad news for us.

On the bright side, Bush and global warming, etc., are helping most people wake up, at least a little, to our inter-relatedness, and perhaps, eventually, to our spiritual essence.

Global warming will bring us all to our knees, under the scalding Sun.

I love how deniers flippantly state that global warming is "natural"....

like that just makes it okay #1

#2 It ALSO ignores the fact that MAN has done tons and tons of OTHER things to the planet that has caused irreperable harm.

I have been reading THE WORLD WITHOUT US.

It is a book about what would happen if Humans were suddently "raptured" up.. gone .. but all the STUFF they created was left behind. What exactly would happen to it.

It is a cautionary strange.. sometimes hopeful tale.....

But humans have short term memory. We do not begin to understand the toxic legacy we are leaving to future generations. We only think til next quarters earnings. We are so quick to push push push.. NOW.

If you are an anti-global warming yet "pro life" person.. I find you to be particularly strange.

IF you are one of those beasts that claims a "Pro Life", Pro war, anti global warming stance...I find it truly IRONIC that you haven't exploded from the conudrum you find yourself in constantly.

You want to save all these BABIES but yet you leave a polluted planet for them to live in.. You promote a war that has killed lots of babies and children... and probably a lot of UNBORN children too (since you care a lot about those).

yet you dismiss any planetary environmental problems that might make it VERY VERY challenging to survive in the future. You can NOTHING about the future UNBORN babies....

That is what cannot wrap my head around....

Sigh.

Read up on things folks... the short version of this article could read;

People stood around for decades pissing into the wind wondering why they kept getting wet all the time.

Invest in umbrellas right?

okiegal:"Don't know if anyone noticed, but we just had a hurricane in Oklahoma on Sunday. (That of course, is impossible!)Seems fitting somehow that it hit the State with the idiot 'global warming is a myth' Senator. Inhofe has been strangely absent.

No one with a brain can stand him. The right wing nuts and the oil companies that keep him in office, unfortunately are the majority here."

Hi - I share your pain over Inhofe. Hurricane Erin gave us hell didn't she, it was scary - and the majority of folk in Oklahoma deserve to be scared again and again - until they wake up!!!

I despair - I really do!

You didn't have a hurricane, Erin was just a lil ole Tropical Storm and I believe it was only a Tropical Depression by the time it hit Oklahoma. Get used to it though, it's only a matter of time before one of these super storm, cat five's comes through and really does some damage. I live on the Gulf Coast and cringe every time I watch the Tropical report...

Presenting facts to the right does not work. This is something that is hard for Progressives to understand or believe. The right does not see the world as a system so it cannot believe that man has the ability to affect the planet.
They believe that the environmentalist movement is where the old communist have reorganized to destroy our country. Therefore, if you even say the word environmentalist to a right winger, he hears communist and the discussion is over. The facts,being communist propaganda, never get through.

Yes, Erin was well broken up by the time it reached us. Still, I hope the long and violent storms and floods served to make Okies wonder whether their Senator is really right about global warming.

A few more like that and there may yet be hope for us all.

The fact that global warming is taking place and the fact that it is man-made are essentially beyond scientific debate. Scientists agree; Saint Dipshit's comments notwithstanding.

But even if that were not the case, the measures we would take to counter global warming all make environmental, economic and strategic sense anyway.

Exactly, WmC - it really is as simple as that. Yet so many refuse to acknowledge as much.

Hey, did anyone notice the most damage is being done in RED states? Wonder what the evangelist that said New Orleans got smashed by Katrina because of it's sinning would say about Texas, Oklahoma and Ohio gettin their asses kicked? Of course Florida got the beat down in '04 and '05, maybe God's trying to tell these fools something?

Its socialism/communism in disguise.

You say that like it's a bad thing.

Joseph McCarthy has an awful lot to answer for in the USA!

A good dose of European-style socialism is what's truly needed, in my view.

But Kristina40,__ Bush LOST in Floida and Ohio, why would God take it out on the people of those states?

Oh,__ never mind. I forgot,__ Bush is God.

They said that Katrina was God's punishment for New Orleans due to gays and other various sins. The only problem was that the French Quarter was not flooded and was left in good shape. This means God missed his intended target. How dare they say that God is a bad shot.

I think global warming is natural. Don't run off, this theory is brilliant. Even if I say so myself.

Humans are aminals. Ergo, part of the ecosystem. Population crashes are part of biological balance. When Coyotes, for example, eat most of the rabbits the grass grows like crazy cause their ain't many rabbits. Since the supply of rabbits goes down the coyotes population crashes. Lack of predation causes a spike in rabbit reproduction. The coyotes have a field day eating rabbits again. Meanwhile, grass is getting scarce because it's being eaten. Rabbit population crash, coyote population crash, grass grows like crazy. That's an oversimplified but valid explanation of how nature works.

Back to us. There's too damn many Humans. We've caused it ourselves because we are bizzar aminals. Not any predators but eachother. Nontheless, there's too many. Time for a crash of Human population. Mother nature is thinning the herd even though we have done it to ourselves. But we're too dumb to know it. Just like coyotes thinking they're in hog heaven.

Scientists also agree that the long term solution to global warming is Nuclear Energy.

Who are these people?

Katrina was a largely man-made disaster. The first rescuers to reach New Orleans were Canadians. The federal government worked to prevent aid from reaching New Orleans because the majority of the people who remained there were poor blacks. It was a planned result of the repulicans white government's racist policy.