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Smashing Capitalism
Somewhere in the Hamptons a high-roller is cursing his cleaning lady and shaking his fists at the lawn guys. The American poor, who are usually tactful enough to remain invisible to the multi-millionaire class, suddenly leaped onto the scene and started smashing the global financial system. Incredibly enough, this may be the first case in history in which the downtrodden manage to bring down an unfair economic system without going to the trouble of a revolution.
First they stopped paying their mortgages, a move in which they were joined by many financially stretched middle class folks, though the poor definitely led the way. All right, these were trick mortgages, many of them designed to be unaffordable within two years of signing the contract. There were "NINJA" loans, for example, awarded to people with "no income, no job or assets." Conservative columnist Niall Fergusen laments the low levels of "economic literacy" that allowed people to be exploited by sub-prime loans. Why didn't these low-income folks get lawyers to go over the fine print? And don't they have personal financial advisors anyway?
Then, in a diabolically clever move, the poor - a category which now roughly coincides with the working class -- stopped shopping. Both Wal-Mart and Home Depot announced disappointing second quarter performances, plunging the market into another Arctic-style meltdown. H. Lee Scott, CEO of the low-wage Wal-Mart empire, admitted with admirable sensitivity, that "it's no secret that many customers are running out of money at the end of the month."
I wish I could report that the current attack on capitalism represents a deliberate strategy on the part of the poor, that there have been secret meetings in break rooms and parking lots around the country, where cell leaders issued instructions like, "You, Vinny -- don't make any mortgage payment this month. And Caroline, forget that back-to-school shopping, OK?" But all the evidence suggests that the current crisis is something the high-rollers brought down on themselves.
When, for example, the largest private employer in America, which is Wal-Mart, starts experiencing a shortage of customers, it needs to take a long, hard look in the mirror. About a century ago, Henry Ford realized that his company would only prosper if his own workers earned enough to buy Fords. Wal-Mart, on the other hand, never seemed to figure out that its cruelly low wages would eventually curtail its own growth, even at the company's famously discounted prices.
The sad truth is that people earning Wal-Mart-level wages tend to favor the fashions available at the Salvation Army. Nor do they have much use for Wal-Mart's other departments, such as Electronics, Lawn and Garden, and Pharmacy.
It gets worse though. While with one hand the high-rollers, H. Lee Scott among them, squeezed the American worker's wages, the other hand was reaching out with the tempting offer of credit. In fact, easy credit became the American substitute for decent wages. Once you worked for your money, but now you were supposed to pay for it. Once you could count on earning enough to save for a home. Now you'll never earn that much, but, as the lenders were saying -- heh, heh -- do we have a mortgage for you!
Pay day loans, rent-to-buy furniture and exorbitant credit card interest rates for the poor were just the beginning. In its May 21st cover story on "The Poverty Business," BusinessWeek documented the stampede, in the just the last few years, to lend money to the people who could least afford to pay the interest: Buy your dream home! Refinance your house! Take on a car loan even if your credit rating sucks! Financiamos a Todos! Somehow, no one bothered to figure out where the poor were going to get the money to pay for all the money they were being offered.
Personally, I prefer my revolutions to be a little more pro-active. There should be marches and rallies, banners and sit-ins, possibly a nice color theme like red or orange. Certainly, there should be a vision of what you intend to replace the bad old system with -- European-style social democracy, Latin American-style socialism, or how about just American capitalism with some regulation thrown in?
Global capitalism will survive the current credit crisis; already, the government has rushed in to soothe the feverish markets. But in the long term, a system that depends on extracting every last cent from the poor cannot hope for a healthy prognosis. Who would have thought that foreclosures in Stockton and Cleveland would roil the markets of London and Shanghai? The poor have risen up and spoken; only it sounds less like a shout of protest than a low, strangled, cry of pain.
274 Comments so far
Show AllCapitalism does not depend on extracting every last cent from the poor. Capitalism is not a zero sum game, it *creates* wealth. If the hundreds of thousands of rules on the books is not 'regulation', I'm not sure even Barbara knows just what the heck she is talking about.
If you don't like capitalism, then don't participate in it. Form your own peaceful collective, and trade amongst yourselves by actual choice. Heck, if it looks good, I'll join in too.
Well, maybe since the Walmarts of the world sent all the jobs overseas, these overseas workers will travel to the USA just to shop at Walmart with their 20 cents an hour wages...or maybe the rich will start buying 2 dollar tube socks in bulk to hide their money in...or maybe monkeys will start to fly out of my butt.
Take about a flawed business model
"I prefer my revolutions to be a little more pro-active" gee i am sorry that you are not happy with how things are getting done.
"The poor have risen up and spoken; only it sounds less like a shout of protest than a low, strangled, cry of pain." and so.... as you look on......you are doing.... what??????
Brilliant -- this is one to be shared, even with my Republican family members who surprisingly liked (and understood) Ms. Ehrenreich's book, NICKEL AND DIMED. Perhaps this article will open their eyes a bit more.
Thank you!
Yesterday, Walmart tried to sell $2.6 billion in corporate bonds and could not. Not only are they seeing reduced sales, but the sub prime uncertainty has kept them from selling bonds to finance inventory. A double whammy from both sides, I would say.
Mtn goat,
I think the problem is that all the incremental wealth creation is retained at the top. None of it trickles down. Trickle down economics has been proven false by decades of empirical data, some 25 to 30 years worth.
Whatever you call our system, it certainly works great for those at the top. I'm not sure I would agree that the upper class lives in capitalism, since all the downside risk is socialized and passed onto the lower classes in the form of heavier taxation, and subsidies upward from the tax base.
The upper class enjoy the unbounded accumulation of the good times in capitalism, and all the social support infrastructure of Socialism when times are down -- ensuring that they never have to endure the lean times.
Capitalism is theft and it does more to create a consciousness of it's alternative than all the leftist propaganda in history. Yes, it creates wealth -- and poverty. One cannot exist without the other. Though it may survive another downturn it will result in the collapse of civilization if it isn't replaced with a saner system that puts power, nature, and human intersts ahead of profits. That may seem "unrealistic" to most Americans spoon fed on the pablum of commercial consumerism, corporte propaganda and commodity fetishism but that alternative it is being built right now in Venezuela and elswhere.
A better world is possible but it ain't for sale.
"But in the long term, a system that depends on extracting every last cent from the poor cannot hope for a healthy prognosis." Excellent point.
A system that exports manufacturing jobs overseas, replaces them with lower income service jobs, does not provide affordable health care for its workers, lives on credit, is not thinking long term. Who and how will they buy the goods they sell and on which the profits are based? This works only for a while and seems the equivalent of burning the furniture to heat the house.
A system based on mutual trade and human ownership of ones's self, mind, and labor is...theft? Wow, what else will we redefine?
I'm sorry, but I can't let MtnGoat's comment go by unchallenged. Let me ask you this, goat, where have you been for the last 7 years? Are you talking about all the regulations that the right has decided NOT to enforce, anymore? THOSE regulations?
Or are you talking about the unmatched tax breaks that business has gotten over the last 25 years? Or the bail outs that big business keeps getting at OUR expense? Like the one they just announced to keep the idiot mortgage lenders from losing their stupid butts?
You must work for the administration, they are the only people left in this country that actually think that what we are doing in sustainable. You actually like that outsourcing of jobs, don't you? You lIKE the drop in wages when those outsourced jobs aren't replaced with anything, don'tyou? You people would prefer that we all get screwed till the day we die, as long as it was by YOU people.
The ONLY way that capitalism doesn't turn into fascism is with serious regulations being put in place, and ENFORCED. You can have all the regulations you want, but without enforcement, you get what we have now. A completely broken system that is headed for a serious fall. It has been unsustainable from the time Reagan proposed it and turned us down this path. I saw it coming then, and I've been waiting for the collapse ever since. It took a while, like things tend to do, but it's coming. And then we will see just how you love this "captalistic" system of yours.
Capitalism is socialism for the rich.
The local flagship state university used to have a suite of small TV rooms each with a set tuned to one of the 5 available channels. Now instead it has some large TVs blaring MTV 24 hours a day in the main eating space of the commons. No one can turn them off or change channels. MTV pays to keep it on. In the other large cafe study space in the same student union, MSNBC blares on 4 large TVs while a radio station keeps up a concurrent barrage. These stations also pay the university to keep them on all the time. Pepsi Cola owns "pouring rights" a monopoly on the soft drink available to students here. Capitalism creates monetary wealth by subtracting from life. And I have given only the mildest of examples.
Marx was predicting that free trade, by destroying the standard of living, was sure to hasten the revolution a long long time ago. He mistakenly thought though that the West was a safety valve, despite the fact that very few people (relative to the whole) actually went West. The reality is that when things get really bad, any remotely organized application of Force will successfully stop a revolution. The Russian revolution (which occurred when horses were the main mode of transportation) only occurred thanks to mass chaos and the army starving. It won't happen here. When the ruling elite accidentally kills off too many slaves, they ease up slightly. And that is all.
And with the increase in technology they really have far, far more slaves than they need. We should consider ourselves lucky that they've allowed so many of us to live, if not sufficient money to try to have children.
Ever notice you never hear Libertarians utter their old battle cry of "git big gubbermint off our backs" anymore? Well, look what happened, a libertarian fantasy turned into a nightmare due to deregulation. That there is some nasty blowback when the truth reveals itself that the capts of industry can't be entrusted to behave in an ethical manner. It is as it has always been--human nature is not the model of Sainthood, but that is what the libertarian religion bases it's free market ideology on. In truth it is naivete--either an inability or an unwillingness to see how it all falls apart despite the gospel of unrestrained free market utopia.
We actually don't live under Capitalism. We taxpayers are peons in a system where the rich and powerful curry favor with the government and get their every heart's desire by means of bribery (lobbying and campaign contributions).
Those of us who can't afford to curry favor and make bribes are squeezed by the system, and the small businessman cannot compete with the giants--who import junk made by slaves in Communist countries.
That isn't capitalism. It's serfdom.
Vern,
I have a similar take on Libertarianism. The Libertarians argue that humans are fundamentally selfish and that is why socialism cannot work. Then they expect these same selfish individual humans to engage in fair play and to be honest in the market, doing what is necessary to preserve the integrity of the market. I always found this to be contradictory.
And it reminds me of a quote from George Bernard Shaw:
"Forgive him, for he believes the customs of his tribe are the laws of nature!"
Here's something I've not seen discussed in the current economic meltdown: Okay, so the Fed can prop up the economy by loosening credit. But what about loans to the U.S. government? The nation itself is running on credit cards and if the world economy rocks, who will loan money at discount rates to prop up the U.S.?
As one of our generals mentioned to the press a year or so ago, "If we ever go to war with China, they can defund our military."
And it isn't like we've been winning a lot of friends lately, what with illegal invasions, torture and freelance assassinations, not to mention, tsk tsk, collateral damage.
Buddy can ya spare a billion?
Go Barbara!
Without regulation that is enforced, and meaningful worker representation, capitalism ALWAYS becomes fascism.
Do you remember the day when corporations, as part of their state charters, had to be good citizens? They had to PROVE that they were a positive force in the communities in which they SERVED. Well, globilization, the destruction of labor unions, and giving corporations "personhood" ended all that.
What we have in America today is fascism. Pure and simple. We are all slaves to the machine. And that's just the way our "government" wants it.
It's good to have MtnGoat posts here, to remind the readers of this excellent site just how far things have gone. Educated, rational folks tend to forget, or disbelive, the ignorance and sadism we're up against.
Paul,
That's what capitalism is, in practice. I've studied enough cultures & historical periods at this point to conclude that virtually all governments have been jural and coercive expressions of private interests. Strip away government and the modern pirates/warlords will continue to ply their trade anyway, with an institution or without one (e.g. Bush's reliance on private mercenaries to fight a somewhat private war).
The best that we can hope for is a reshaping of government -- to protect large numbers of people AGAINST exploitation from its most powerful (utilitarian sort of way), rather than facilitating/justifying it (the historical co-option).
Jaded Prole Amen !! Venezuela in cooperation with Cuba, Bolivia, Nicaragua and others to join soon show the way for a Better World which is Possible. Their production and distribution of wealth is based on cooperation and solidarity for the satisfaction of human needs as contrasted to the capitalist market where fierce competitiveness annihilates the smaller party
for the sake of profit maximization. Venezuela and the other countries are benefitting from each other's strengths, whereas the capitalist transnational corporations exploit the weaknesses of the economically weaker countries.
These and a few other differences make the new wave of Latin America towards a better life very promising. Their humanistic model is called Alternativa Bolivariana para las Americas ( ALBA)which is the antithesis of the neoliberal model of capitalistic markets known as FTAA which is supported by the USA.
In all Latin American countries the people know ALBA. They talk about it and support ALBA's beautiful methods of cooperation and solidarity. Here in the USA we know nothing
because the corporations and their mainstream media do not want us to know anything.
On the other hand, I live amongst the poor, and nearly everyone has cable and/or satellite hooked up to their big screen TV, they all have the latest and greatest in cell tech, and most drive autos way above anything affordable in their income level - in a bunch of cases, the monthly on the car is higher than the rent.
A little self-restraint and temptation resistance is in order.
Meanwhile, expecting a class of people living hand to mouth already to rise up and sacrifice what little they have for the cause is unrealistic. The revolution MUST begin and be led by what's left of the middle class - they are the ones who need to start voting with their wallets. Exxon profits are up - how is that? Stop buying gas from them. Stop shopping at the Wal Marts, stop paying your taxes, and stop supporting enablers like FOX and their advertisers. Cancel your cable. Switch your voter registration to Independent.
And stop hoping the poor will rise up and save you - they won't. But they will join you when you decide to fight.
MtnGoat: I think you should hoof your way back to that isolated cabin in the woods of some backwards-ass country town (sounds of Deliverance ringing in my ears) where you escaped from. People like you are the very reason this country is the world's grossest polluter, leads the industrialized world in income disparity, ranks just above Slovakia in public health, and ranks equal with Iran in freedom of the press. You have been systematically - like all of us - propagandized by the corporate fascists who actually run this country from the day you were born. The difference between you and me, and perhaps many others here, is that I don't give a shit about wealth! What I am concerned about is the health, education, lodging, and access to information - particularly on what the government is doing in my name - for EVERY SINGLE PERSON IN THIS COUNTRY, INCLUDING YOU!
Barbara ought to be worshiped, like a modern day goddess for the work she does in exposing the working poor in this country, and the slave laborers our biggest retail corporations utilized to feed our grotesque opulence.
In the now immortal words of ex-Intel CEO Andy Grove: "The goal of the new capitalism is to shoot the wounded."
Wake up!
"I think the problem is that all the incremental wealth creation is retained at the top. None of it trickles down."
I could not disagree more. Wealth is not only money, it is also goods and services. The rich are not simultaneously driving 90000 cars each and wearing 350,000 pairs of shoes, nor eating five zillion tons of chicken or wearing a million pairs of eyeglasses.
For every penny of money going to capital, a penny of goods is dispersed. Every single trader in a trade has innately agreed that what they are trading away is less valuable to them then what they are getting.
The idea that wealth is only represented by half of what takes place is provably wrong. If no one valued *as* wealth what they are getting when they trade away the only thing you recognize as wealth, THEY WOULD NOT DO SO. If that hunk of roast beef isn't of value to you, why do you trade wealth for it?
unbridled capitalism and unbridled socialism are both bad ideas, both lead to the oppression of the population. There must be some middle ground that would work.
CrCox, I think you should grow up and perhaps take a look at arguments you don't agree with without the anti human goggles you have on. We've all been propogandized by all sides, and all that matters is our minds and our ability to compare arguments for consistency and actual logic, not the pretend kind.
I live in the same sea of ideas you do, as do we all... and if it's all so complex...how is it *you* think you have it right? Is there something special about you?
I don't give a crap about wealth either. That's why I don't argue to take it from people while telling them how bad they are for wanting to keep what I intend to take. I'm not rich, I have no intention of doing what it takes to become rich...but nor will I claim I am superior to those who are...just so I can justify taking what I claim is wrong to have, because I want it for my own purposes, like you do.
Why don't you just cooperate openly with people who believe like you, organize non profit corporations and health care cooperatives with like minded people, and show us how your caring can really work...without the crutch of making other people do what you want?
To use a much overused analogy, perhaps we the people should utilize this rather unintentional revolution to make lemonade out of lemons, dig? I mean, let's face it, the best thing that could happen for those of us who are in debt up to our eyeballs is for the stock market to fail and the banks fall right along with them. Look what happened following the Great Depression: the biggest publics works programs in the country started. Following that you had things like the California State University system develop, which was for a very long time the largest free higher education system in the world. California was churning out educated individuals by the thousands every year, building the strongest economy in the country.
Anyway, the larger point here is, until everything comes crashing down around our feet, we will have no chance at changing it as much as it needs to be changed. Case in point: I have a degree that I have put to good use, doing work that I think really matters, and at a company that treats me very well and even gives me health care. However, I am only paid in the low-30's and I have well over $75,000 in college loan debt, as well as a car payment. For all intents and purposes, it actually makes more sense for me, financially, not to pay the college loans at all. You see, as long as I pay only the minimum payment, the principle stays the same, and I cannot afford to pay much more than that payment. I have done the math: even if I pay an extra $50 per month on my college loans, they will be paid off long after my death. My decision? Fuck the college loans. In my lifetime I will put into the economy at least $1 million more than someone who does not have a college degree. For that, they can take my loan and shove it. The education should have been a social investment.
I am only one of millions who live under the tyranny of the bottom line, because we have been frightened away from taking any real action. Perhaps Barbara is right, and the inherently inefficient methodology of the "free market" has begun to unravel this problem for us. We must learn to take advantage of that situation and wrest control of this country back from the greedy hands that hijacked it from us back in the Regan years.
Peace through revolution!
Brevity, shocking little vignette about the 'local flagship state university'. You would do us a favour by naming the institution.
the problem is that Capitalism is not really what we have in America, if by Capitalism you mean a free market of rational actors all seeking to maximize their own wealth through the buying and selling of goods and services...America is an International Banking System wherein the Banks create money through debt...no debt, no money...this is WHY they gave out the subprime loans...it was to stave off the recession of 2001...now the chickens are coming home to roost...all it will take is a single tremor to send everyone into bankruptcy or clawing their bank door to get their money...one problem, the banks dont HAVE any money...all they have is debt...welcome to the other side of the looking glass...
Unregulated capitalism is feudalism.
Peace to you and yours.
MtnGoat: Sorry brother, very weak argument. None of this has anything to do with seeing oneself as "superior." That's your terminology, not mine. In fact, I would argue the complete opposite: I see the good of society as superior to the good of powerful, landed, inherited minority. And save the bullshit argument that anyone can make it in America, or some crap like that. You know as well as the rest of us that it is an extreme minority that make it out of the depths of poverty into the gates of the wealthy, untaxed, unburdened elite.
Lastly, I do indeed cooperate with people who believe like me. As a matter of fact I am routinely chastised for it and called a "Commie". Accurate as that might be. However, we are grossly outnumbered by those who have savored the individualist Kool-Aide. You are obviously full of punch drunk love yourself.
Really lastly this time: I agree with "bligh" in that "unbridled capitalism and unbridled socialism" are both bad ideas. The path lies with both forms, and I believe Communism is the somewhat unreachable state, and economic nirvana if you will. The Communisim that we have seen in the world, for the most part, was simply authoritarian dictatorship, taking on the name of socialism and communism, as though they are the very same thing.
"First of all, ANY economic system that feeds & houses its people, from hunters & gatherers to the Romans to the USSR to the USA, "creates" wealth."
The USSR did not create wealth. It lacked the mechanism to actually create it instead of mining it from it's people. Zero sum games such as socialism merely extract from citizens, and no amount of shuffling can fill in the gaps without predation. This is why the soviet union collapsed...it did not actually generate net surplus and given the costs it attempted to pay in the end years, the entire charade collapsed.
There is a vast difference between creating wealth (surplus wealth), and robbing peter to pay paul.
"There's no need to give capitalism special credit by grandly proclaiming that it " **creates** wealth," as though some extraordinary magic were involved."
The only 'magic' is the surplus creation of free trade.
"It is destroying the planet, creating conditions for permanent war, & poisoning social relations."
Please. If anyone is 'destroying the planet', it is you and people like you who preach one thing and consume anyway. You and everyone else can at any time choose to reduce your standard of living and stop consuming. Since you claim so many of you support this, merely stopping what you are doing will have the impact of a massive reduction in consumption. Stop blaming other people for what your actions actually are.
Ditto for 'permanent war' and 'poisoning social relations'. Your relations are only as 'poisoned' as you make them, and your attitude here towards disagreement is positively toxic. I'd never claim you should be forced to consume what you don't want, work where you don't wish to, pay for what you don't like or want, or serve my ideals. Yet here you are taking the toxic attitude that we all need to be fixed to satisfy you. If there's toxicity here, it's from your intolerance of other ideas and other actions.
"It distributes its generated wealth very inequitably."
Since when are people entitled to what they do not produce or own? You act as if there is some big pot of money sitting around that belongs to everyone, and it's doled out unfairly.
"It's faulty thinking to imagine capitalism as simply being the relatively high living standards in the USA, Japan & Western Europe. Those living standards wouldn't be so high, if OTHER societies in the less-developed world weren't paying the price for it."
No, it's faulty thinking to imagine trade is zero sum and that for some to be rich, others must be poor.
"The unfair trade relationships imposed by the "developed" (ie, better-armed & more ruthlessly acquisitive) world on the less-developed nations, ever since colonial days, allowed the wealthy nations to live well at the expense of the exploited."
There is definitely truth to this, as unacceptable and unjust conditions were imposed by colonial actors. However, this is not what capitalism is, no more than Stalin's actions represent socialism.
"Except for the New Deal era & its immediate aftermath, laws have been made by the wealthy to benefit the wealthy."
Do you have any idea that only a couple of FDR's programs actually survived judicial review, and that the ones which did survive STILL benefit the wealthy after being designed by the wealthy? Take a look at the payment share into SSec vs the benefits paid in terms of progressive taxation rates and you'll find that once again, the wealthy are capped in payment while the poor contribute a much larger share, and it goes to non means tested individuals. Once again, a system designed by the wealthy for the wealthy. It appears to work otherwise, but when examined closely...is more of the same.
You seem to be operating under the mistaken idea that people in power will not do what benefits them for their own reasons. The only constant in human behavior is selfishness, and here you wish to add power to selfish people and then expect them to act differently than everyone else...which is drastically wrrong.
"To glorify capitalism as a system "based on mutual trade and human ownership of ones's self, mind, and labor" is simply to regurgitate one's capitalist indoctrination."
No, it's simply to reiterate it's foundational principles instead of those babbled by those who hate it. I don't go to the anti communist league to examine the basis for ideas lik are espounded here, I ask real socialists what their ideas are.
I'd think that if you are as smart as you obviously think you are, you'd examine the actual principles you claim to be judging, instead of taking talking points from groups who mistate these principles to begin with, then judge their own mistaken restatements, then pronounce their judgements valid.
Hard to say on Communism. Whatever it was historically clearly failed on the grand scale, whether it was Communism is another issue...
Capitalism has become the idiocy of arguing what's good for one is good for all. And thus, to make it seem as if what is good for a few will be good for the many.
But it is insanely illogical to believe altruism and social benevolence results from achievement fostered by self-enrichment and aggrandizement. The same folks that promote that baloney are the same that say without the enticement and incentive of personal financial wealth little progress would be achieved.
But you can't have it both ways, so which is it, are folks motivated for common good or for personal wealth?
Surely, if there were any real equity in the idea that the wealthy give back to society and help make the world a better place, then the world would be very different indeed. (Instead, we have individuals today making more money in a year than a billion, count 'em, other people. Doesn't that scream out to anyone??? That's not free enterprise, that's a great and grievous crime against all humanity.)
Still, capitalism does have its merits, and if the rewards of capitalism were truly cycled back then the whole can indeed be lifted. But when left unchecked capitalistic self-interest will absolutely become corrupt. I thought that was common sense, and as such, was the reason for government oversight, public regulation, ethical and legal accountability and social responsibility.
The problem isn't with capitalism per se, the problem is that the fox (pun intended) is now guarding the hen house. The problem is that the poor and middle classes aren't in control. The problem is that we have sold the public interest to private enterprise with little to no ROI for the public good. The problem is that we have been hoodwinked into yielding our power to power mongers.
The problem is "we the people" no longer own or run the farm – maybe we never did.
" However, I am only paid in the low-30's and I have well over $75,000 in college loan debt, as well as a car payment. For all intents and purposes, it actually makes more sense for me, financially, not to pay the college loans at all. You see, as long as I pay only the minimum payment, the principle stays the same, and I cannot afford to pay much more than that payment. I have done the math: even if I pay an extra $50 per month on my college loans, they will be paid off long after my death. My decision? Fuck the college loans. "
So you choose to go to college, you choose to educate yourself knowing the debt that would accrue, you chose your current job, and now you'll leave it to everyone else getting loans to pay off your default...all the while blaming the aggregate outcome of all your choices on someone else. Everyone else will pay higher rates due to your INTENTIONAL decision to fail to pay off what you choose to accrue. Nice. Are those other people your tools to carry paying off your loans?
Look, the bottom line is there are those who believe in equality of condition and those who believe in what we have been led to believe is "equality of opportunity." You know, a rising tide lifts all boats. Nobody ever asks what happens to the boats that are tied to the docks, dig?
With unregulated capitalism, there are only two paths:
1- At some point in a society's history, the bulk of the population somehow manages to have a grand awakening in which every person is able to purchase, invest, and use according to his or her own personal ideological agenda, so that bad economics only happens to bad people. That's the world that the MtnGoats think exists already.
2- The whole of society comes crashing down like a ton of brick because the a pyramid after all cannot stand on its head for very long. Eventually, the wind will blow.
I think communism could work for maybe 200 people on an island somewhere. For larger countries, it has seemed to have always devolved into a personality cult for the "great leader",a small elite that has access to a life unavailable to the other 99%, and state oppression against anyone that won't go along.
-Sounds like unbridled capitalism again.
You are quite right MtnGoat. I made the intentional decision to go to school and become educated instead of staying home and being continuously dumbed down or locked into a do-nothing job for the rest of my life. I loved going to college more than anything in the world, as a matter of fact. And I was willing to do whatever I had to go the best college I could. To be honest, if I had it to do all over again, I would not have attended the finest music conservatory in the world. You see, the problem is, I was a happy capitalist back then. I believed fully in my ability to pay off my loans someday, because after all, this is America! I can do whatever I set my mind to, right?
I did just that. I not only played music professionally for almost 16 years, but I even went back to college in my early 30's for a second degree! That time I didn't incure much debt though. I was smarter, more wise about how the world actually works. I learned that debt-free education is only for the elite.
"The poor have risen up and spoken..."
The poor people in America are among the richest people on the planet; but our economic system stinks though.
We have too much individualism and greed, political corruption, lack affordable and guaranteed education and health care for all...
"there should be a vision of what you intend to replace the bad old system with"
Sure, at the very least European-style social democracy for me, living in the Norway of America would be a much better decent place ...a bit of socialism indeed
MtnGoat what are you smoking? I have a few other questions for you.
How do you know capitalism is not a "zero sum game?"
Exactly how is wealth created in capitalism?
I love the title on this one!
Unfortunately, I don't think there has been, or ever will be socialism arising successfully and spontaneously from society's poorest. If there were indeed a spontaneous socialist revolution by the most oppressed, it is only because of an historically tragic dearth of leadership. And it is doomed. Without disciplined leadership and a powerful program, naked capitalism will weedle its way back into the drivers seat, and happy friends next door be damned.
There is no reason to suffer through the mistakes of the past, though. There are many twists, turns and traps out there, and the leadership of a learned and disciplined party is needed to embody our best aspirations for freedom and knowledge about the past. Without such a party, bulding socialism will be Sisyphean, constantly finding us again in the rut of war and poverty.
Bligh: Bang on. My wife is from Hungary and we both are in agreement that life in Hungary under Communism was precisely what life is like under modern American capitalism, just minus the constant reminder everywhere you look that there are those who have obscene amounts of money. She is always saying that American culture just constantly rubs the wealth of the minority into your face, so that you are always reminded to buy, buy, buy. She has a great point there. In any case, as I mentioned before, I do not, nor do most Communists today, think that Communism is a system that can effectively be used in America, not until we have achieved Socialism first. Socialism, by its very nature (keeping in mind the much evolved literature about it we have today) does indeed utilize the market. The modern day Communist believes that Socialism is the middle step. I myself think the jury is still out on whether real Communism will ever be realized. But, in the meantime, I think it is a great goal to have. It's like enlightenment. Most Buddhists feel that they will never reach enlightenment in this life, but that they will get there in another.
After all is said and done the Conservative philosophy boils down to intellectual arguments to justify greed and the accumulation of vast wealth.
Of course Capitalism creates wealth, lots of it. But it has always done a terrible job of distributing it.
And when things break down Capitalism goes out the door like right now when the Mortgage Lenders and Bankers are all yelling for the government to save their asses from their own stupidity. Or the giant corporations who claim "we're too big to let fail" and ask for a handout, er..bailout.
We must not however, extend bailouts to the poor and those about to lose their homes. That would be SOCIALISM and that's bad, bad, bad.
Capitalism is terrible enough, Mtn Goat, and it's even worse when surrounded by hypocrisy. Conservatives like to talk about incentives. Well, seeing these bastards never suffer the consequences of their actions (like the dim bulb in White House) should be a tremendous dis-incentive for poor working stiffs to bust their asses for the system.
The difference between CEO pay and the pay of the average worker has been growing like crazy ever since the stupid Reagan administration. Even CEO's who screw up their companies walk away with millions in Golden Parachutes.
What I'd like to see is Investment Bakers, Mortgage Lenders, Corporate CEO's, Outsourcers, Hucksters and all the other financial Sharpies hanging around Home Depot looking for Day Labor jobs or selling bags of oranges by the Freeway on ramp. Let them sample that side of Capitalism!
Yours for the Revolution!
Widen the lens....Read Riane Eisler's Real Wealth of Nations and Marjorie Kelly's The Divine Right of Capital and you'll see how we got into this mess....and how we can get out and end up with a saner world.
Right now, 20% of American's own 91% of the wealth and 80% own just 9%. A system this imbalanced reflects a 'dominator' value that we've all become accustomed to and accept--but it isn't one that can result in a high quality of life for all. Eventually a 'king of the hill' game has to collapse.
The rules of Capitalism are simple: Ultimately one guys owns it all. Don't believe me? buy a monopoly game and teach yourself how to be a player. That's why it matters not to the winners about the losers. As long as they are winning, life is good [loan me $300 so I can buy Board Walk, and I'll give you free rent on Atlantic...]
My other point is a corollary to the Rules of Capitalism: These big players don't care about a 'healthy prognosis' or a sustainable future. They will take theirs NOW! Thank You Very Much, Hold the fries and whine...
The corollary explains why regulations don't work as planned.
I wonder if Rupert will be the Big Dog, of if some one from China will outsmart him?
Right on McDee!
On the issue of debt:
I am a professor in a small private college. The yearly tuition, including room and board, is at least 50,000/year, and is increased every year about 3% (public college tuitions are also rising). My students are, rightfully, obsessed with their accruing debt and their justified fear that they will not be able to find a job after graduation that will allow them to support themselves and pay off their loans. One of my students burst into tears in my office over this very issue. And, if often seems as if the kids from lower-income families are more serious about their studies because there is more at stake for them than for kids whose parents can afford the tuition.
The very notion of buying property and having a family is becoming a mere fantasy for most. Whatever political party you're affiliated with, I think it should be a goal for this country for people to be able to get a college education, to buy property, to raise a family, without the shadow of massive debt hanging over them, preventing them from even dreaming about these most basic desires, desires my parents (married, had 3 kids, bought a house in NYC in the 1960s) did not have to question. I myself am lucky to have a full time job with benefits. Most of my colleagues can only find part-time jobs, forcing them to teach at multiple institutions (academia is going the way of journalism: no more good full-time jobs--the profession is being eroded from within).
Mountain Goat suggests that going to college is a "choice" and that you deserve the debt if you "choose" to go. Excuse me, but I find this statement appalling. It seems he/she has no problem with a nation populated by uneducated people. But then again, perhaps she/he is coming from this group. I thought education was one of the core shared values in this country, at least in principle.
I see the king of the Swiftboaters - MTNGOAT - is bleating in the wilderness again.
Just another lickspittle in service of greed.
I truly believe in free enterprise. The basic problem is that free enterprise without any type of a cap....say a few million bucks...leads to an acceleration of avarice, and ultimately the purchase of huge blocks of land (try COUNTRIES, for example...) Four letter words matter no longer, in the light of the the big five-letter one: G-R-E-E-D!!!!
YES, this is capitalism at its best.
Those who still believe that the US system is a failed capitalism and that there is another "pure & clean capitalism are just drinking the koolaid. Go ahead and knock yourself out.
For those who are more serious and inquisitive thiknkers, I would like to recomend a book.
"Kicking Away the Ladder: Development Strategy in Historical Perspective" by Ha-Joon Chang.
It has very good analyses on the international economics, politics, free trade, and capitalism.
( this does not mean that I completely agree with the conclusion of the author)