Subscribe to Common Dreams News Updates
Most Popular This Week
Popular content
Today's Top News
The Impeachment Imbroglio: Sheehan, Conyers, Pelosi, and Feingold
The blogosphere was aquiver with the news that Cindy Sheehan announced she will challenge House Speaker Nancy Pelosi as an independent, since Pelosi has refused to renounce her position that impeachment is "off the table." Sheehan promptly got herself arrested in the office of Congressman John Conyers, who heads the House Judiciary Committee.
"The Democrats will not hold this administration accountable, so we have to hold the Democrats accountable," Sheehan said. She and a group of other pro-impeachment activists were arrested in Conyers's office after a meeting at which Conyers told the activists that he lacked the votes for impeachment. Sheehan's group began a sit-in, demanding that Conyers sign onto Representative Dennis Kucinich's impeachment bill. Conyers eventually called the Capitol Police to arrest the protesters and drag them away.
The group AfterDowningStreet.org and the political newsletter Counterpunch attacked Conyers for hypocrisy. Sheehan expressed disgust and dismay. A fight broke out between supporters of the Democrats and leftwing activists online.
I asked John Nichols, whose book The Genius of Impeachment: The Founders' Cure for Royalism recently hit number 17 on Amazon, what he made of the whole Sheehan/Conyers imbroglio.
The internal strife on the left probably doesn't make much difference to the chances for impeachment, he says. That's because, Nichols explains, no one leader in the House can make impeachment happen.
"John Conyers wants to impeach, there's no question of that. He wrote a book on it last year. He moved the proposal to set up a special committee to do it. But Pelosi has made it clear she doesn't want to do it," Nichols says.
"We're exactly where we've been all along, which is this process is going to have to go member by member, getting them to sign on. John Conyers would be absolutely delighted if he were forced to take up impeachment."
The notion that John Conyers or Nancy Pelosi can make impeachment happen is mistaken, Nichols says. "The way Jefferson and Madison set it up, it's supposed to be an organic process--it comes from people slowly convincing individual members to step up."
To date, some 15 members have signed on to the proposal to impeach Cheney, and 20 have spoken out in favor of impeachment generally. It would take 50 to pose a real threat. But as more and more voters and their representatives take an interest, the chances for impeachment grow.
The day before the Sheehan/Conyers imbroglio, Senator Russ Feingold, Democrat of Wisconsin, renewed his call of a year ago to censure the President. (Only a House member, not a Senator, can begin the impeachment process.) In 2006, Feingold called for censure because of revelations about the Administration's illegal wiretapping program, and the cover-up that ensued. His current pair of resolutions, which he announced on "Meet the Press" with Tim Russert on Sunday, would cite the Administration's continuing misleading statements on the Iraq War and what Feingold calls Bush's "attack on the rule of law" and the U.S. Constitution, as well as the use of torture.
A little later, on CBS's Face the Nation, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, Democrat of Nevada, said he wouldn't be joining the censure drive. Echoing the White House response to the censure effort, Reid cited all the other work the Senate needs to do, adding: "He's the worst President in history. I don't think we need a censure resolution to prove that."
Russert hit on the same theme, suggesting that Feingold's censure resolution is "political" (i.e., a bunch of useless posturing). And even Feingold himself nodded to the "let's-not-waste-time-and-energy" defensive posture struck by the Democrats ever since they won back Congress in the midterm elections. "We don't need to tie up the House and Senate with an impeachment trial" to take the lesser step of censure, he said, though he also didn't rule out impeachment.
On his website, Feingold directs constituents to a blog he wrote on the subject for Daily Kos, in which he explains that he is not convinced impeachment is the way to go, even though "the list of administration wrongdoing, misleading statements, and out and out lies, just keeps getting longer. Congress should censure the President not only for the illegal wiretapping program, but for the administration's phony reasons for going to war in Iraq, for trashing habeas corpus, for giving the green light to torture, and the list goes on and on. I want Congress to condemn what the administration has done, both for the American people, and for history."
He asks for support from the pro-impeachment netroots: "I know some of you may not believe these resolutions are enough, and I understand that. I am as frustrated as you are about this administration's actions and I hope the proposal I made today is something you'll consider helping me with (in addition to other efforts you may support). Together we will hold this administration accountable for its many abuses. The history books will show we were vocal in condemning the President's abuses of power."
While Democrats give voice to public discontent with the Bush administration, the leadership is still operating on the theory that as Bush and the Republicans head off the cliff, the best course of action is to get out of the way. Politically, Nichols concedes, they might be right: "They should just stand up and say if we abdicate our constitutional responsibilities and don't do our job, we'll reap the benefits. It will allow us to do good things. They might be right. Standing by and letting a crash occur might benefit you. That's a credible case."
Of course, the Democrats are saying no such thing. Instead, they talk about getting on with the important business of the Congress, and not wasting time on impeachment. The argument that impeachment would be a time-waster is, according to Nichols, "bullshit." He points out that the same Congress that impeached Richard Nixon accomplished a great deal, in terms of dialing down the Vietnam war, raising the minimum wage, passing environmental legislation, and making other important, progressive gains.
"The idea that taking up impeachment will keep us from acting on health care, gay rights, etc., is ahistoric," Nichols says. "The fact of the matter is that during the impeachment of Nixon back in the 70s, the reason Congress was so effective and got so much done was that Nixon was scared and, in a calculated move, started cooperating with Congress to avoid impeachment. So the right thing to do is move immediately--see what you can get out of Bush."
For that theory to win the day, the pressure on Congress from voters has to continue to grow.


127 Comments so far
Show AllDims are by nature opportunists. Repugs can make them dance to any tune and pass any legislation without even reading it because they know how to play opportunists like an old fiddle.
It's time the Dims learn a few lessons from the repugs but since they won't, it's time for us to support alternatives.
Given the facts, Congress has an affirmative obligation to impeach.
I don't believe that there was a "grassroots" outcry to impeach Bill Clinton. Several of the right-wing big mouths took this glorious task upon themselves, even to the point of tears in the case of the grand horse's ass -- felon Tom Delay.
No, this is yet another tedious example of the weakness and fecklessness of the Democratic Party. If there is ever was a reason to impeach then this president created it. These gutless Dems were elected, don't forget, because of the outrage and disgust over this criminal administration. Now we have to convince each one, one at a time, to do what they were elected to do? I don't think so. I'm voting Green or anything else.
Since the democrats are so wimpish and co-opted impeachment will have to be done at the grassroots level.
Every congressmans home office needs to be visited-daily- by those of us who marched and protested... and accomplished nothing.
They must know there will be a definite price for their inaction.
http://www.sheehanforcongress.us is a site where early supporters of Sheehan's promised run for Congress can sign up in advance. We are self-organizing until the official campaign gets started.
Ruth Conniff (and the Progressive mag) should be considered persona non grata among decent progressives and radicals after her despicable treatment of Norman Finkelstein on Wisconsin Public Radio. Conniff trotted out the false claim that Finkelstein is a Holocaust minimizer and other baseless blather.
http://www.normanfinkelstein.com/article.php?pg=3&ar=67
The Progressive is anyway a generally milquetoast mag that always seems to manage to find a way to apologize for Democratic Party shortcomings and neo-Zionism. Now after 4 years of being bombed and shot at by Americans the Dems are actually blaming the Iraqis for not "stepping up". Ergo, impeachment of Bush or Cheney seems silly to me: although it might be fun to watch, it would let the corporate money saturated Democratic Party enablers of Bush's war machine off the hook.
Impeachment will not remove Bush from the Presidency. Dems do not have teh supermajority in the Senate necessary to achieve, and NO REPUBLICANS will defect on that issue. We will have to wait until those same Republicans are voted out of office in 2008, then we willhave the necessary supermajorities to impeach Alito and Roberts for lying to Congress.
Get a clue. Play your cards right and we will have 25 years of Dem control.
RE: NICHOLS - SO WHERE DOES HE STAND...
Is Nichols ambivalent about going ahead with impeachment? Or is he counseling progressives to lay off the impeachement demands?
On the one hand, he says "politically" Democrats might be right to do nothing, but stand back and let Republicans continue their car crash (with the caveat that Dems' 'let's not distract ourselves but get things done' argument is false). That's a "credible" argument.
And, further, he rejects pressuring or blaming Conyers or Pelosi: "The notion that John Conyers or Nancy Pelosi can make impeachment happen is mistaken, Nichols says. 'The way Jefferson and Madison set it up, it's supposed to be an organic process–it comes from people slowly convincing individual members to step up.'"
This is specious. 1) Impeachment can't be 'top-down'? Nichols ignores the 'top-down' influence of Pelosi's statement as House Speaker when she declared impeachment was "off the table." 2) It's not a question of their "making it happen" - it's a question of their actively working to make it happen, and individual legislators working to make it happen is part of an "organic" process.
But then on the other hand, in conclusion, Nichols seems to come down on the side of action now: impeachment proceedings reigned in Nixon even while he was in office, and, thus, "the right thing to do is move immediately."
The Goddamned President, Veep, and numerous members of the Executive branch are Felonious lawbreakers and war criminals, who continue to commit the most heineous of crimes, and all we get is the lame ass excuse of "we don't have the time" to enforce the law. BULLSHIT!
As I've written before, it's painfully clear the Democrats want to preserve the institution of Presidential Impunity, so they can continue the mayhem after Bush. This comes as no surprise to those knowing post-WW2 US history. Peaceful means of affecting change are evaporating as both factions of the Death Party seek to preserve the Empire and the perogivites of its elite. This in turn goes against the interest of every other living creature. The Death Party will only be destroyed through physical battle, a conclusion detestable for those wanting peace and justice--two goals I certainly want to accomplish. The enemy is Domestic and deeply entrenched at the federal level, yet it is not only in government as it exists in other fora too, like the lobbyists and the many corporate-backed "think-tanks." One thing we certainly DON'T need is "25 years of Dem control."
Oh how, I wish I could live in the Bay Area, so I could vote for Cindy Sheehan.
Guillermo (NYC) Let's Go Mets - All the Way!
More apologetics from so-called progressives(Must be the Hillary variety). Never in our history has there been a more criminal presidency that threatens the very foundation of our constitution and, if not arrested, sets a dangerous precedent for the future--yet there is every roadblock thrown up to diffuse momentum. Votes didn't seem to be a problem to railroad Slick Willy-impeached for the crime of lying about a blowjob. And those old Republican dinosaurs didn't start out gunning for Nixon.
Democrats don't want to go there because they were, and still are, complicit and they don't want to risk getting snared in the net.
Bottom line: Congress needs to do their job.
"...the pressure on Congress from voters has to continue to grow." while we put down those who turn up the heat as an "attention whores". Gotta wonder.
Nichols makes some excellent, practical points, especially this one:
"The idea that taking up impeachment will keep us from acting on health care, gay rights, etc., is ahistoric," Nichols says. "The fact of the matter is that during the impeachment of Nixon back in the 70s, the reason Congress was so effective and got so much done was that Nixon was scared and, in a calculated move, started cooperating with Congress to avoid impeachment. So the right thing to do is move immediately–see what you can get out of Bush."
But noting that it's member-by-member begs the question: why isn't Conyers one of those Members? Look at the list on Thomas.
H.RES.333
Title: Impeaching Richard B. Cheney, Vice President of the United States, for high crimes and misdemeanors.
Sponsor: Rep Kucinich, Dennis J. [OH-10] (introduced 4/24/2007) Cosponsors (14)
COSPONSORS(14), BY DATE [order is left to right]: (Sort: alphabetical order)
Rep Clay, Wm. Lacy [MO-1] - 5/1/2007
Rep Schakowsky, Janice D. [IL-9] - 5/1/2007
Rep Wynn, Albert Russell [MD-4] - 5/10/2007
Rep Clarke, Yvette D. [NY-11] - 6/6/2007
Rep Lee, Barbara [CA-9] - 6/7/2007
Rep Woolsey, Lynn C. [CA-6] - 6/7/2007
Rep Waters, Maxine [CA-35] - 6/12/2007
Rep Johnson, Henry C. "Hank," Jr. [GA-4] - 6/28/2007
Rep Ellison, Keith [MN-5] - 6/28/2007
Rep McDermott, Jim [WA-7] - 7/10/2007
Rep Moran, James P. [VA-8] - 7/10/2007
Rep Farr, Sam [CA-17] - 7/12/2007
Rep Filner, Bob [CA-51] - 7/12/2007
Rep Brady, Robert A. [PA-1] - 7/24/2007
Schakowsky, Lee, Woolsey, Waters, McDermott, Filner...why isn't Conyers' name on that list? It's one thing for him to say that he can't hold hearings. It's another thing for him to refuse to put his name down on the piece of paper.
RE: INTERVIEWING ONLY NICHOLS AS AN AUTHORITY
Pro-impeachment progressives Dave Lindorff and David Swanson are both important players in the debate - Coniff should have highlighted the real argument in the progressive community by directly including their views, not just citing an article in afterdowningstreet.org (Swanson's website) or an article in counterpunch.
RE: NICHOLS - 'IT'S GOTTA BE MEMBER-BY-MEMBER' ... AND YET CONYERS ISN'T ON LIST
Robert Naiman July 25th, 2007 12:33 pm
"noting that it's member-by-member begs the question: why isn't Conyers one of those Members?"
Yup - Nichols is being an apologist and avoiding an obvious problem w/his exculpation of Conyers.
The decision to impeach is not for Reid, Pelosi, Conyers, or anyone else in Congress to decide. The Constitution demands it if crimes were committed. If oral sex warrants impeachment, why don't the Dems think invading a country based on lies, torturing people, and spying on its own citizens warrant impeachment?
Again, impeachment will not remove Bush from the Presidency. It will not dissuade him from anything. What good is it, so history can say it happenned?
Not moving to Impeach is like witnessing a murder robbery and deciding, "well maybe we don't have enough back up, and well, the store will be open soon and maybe the criminals will be gone anyway". What a bunch of spineless losers.
I still believe that for impeachment to proceed viably, the first order of business for Congress is to repeal the 2002 Iraq War Authorization for Use of Military Force resolution, and also repeal the immunity granted to those engaged in torture by the immunity provisions of the Military Commissions Act.
It's really hard to call things a high crime when the legislative branch continues to authorize it or shield the wrongdoers from prosecution by statute.
Bill from Saginaw
He wrote a book about....
There you go genuine concern! Darth Vader shows up and rather than shooting at him these people write a book to make a buck.
ABOLISH THE GOVERNMENT NOW
You can call your members of Congress now toll free at 866-338-1015, 800-459-1887 or 800-614-2803. Phone Chairman Conyers at 202-225-5126 and ask him to support HR 333 and to start the impeachment of Dick Cheney; and phone your own Congress Member at 202-224-3121 and ask them to immediately call Conyers' office to express their support for impeachment.
As Frederick Douglass said, "Agitate, agitate, agitate"
Impeach for Peace
Quit being so progressive, and be revolutionary. Overthrow our farce of a government, and let's set up a working-class run country that the rest of the world can truly aspire to be.
Why is John Nichols even given space for this pathetic propaganda for the corrupt D's in the House. Those of us with experience on the Hill see it for the sad little apology it is.
The way to get the votes is for the leadership to free the progressives who want to impeach and then order the rest of them to sign on - the way they do on all the other votes.
How many times do congresspeople vote the way they are told by leadership? All day, every day.
"Get a clue. Play your cards right and we will have 25 years of Dem control."
Well as a longtime Green party supporter, activist, and now registered voter, I don't want 25 yrs of Dem control any more than 25 yrs of Rep control!!
The more these two parties switch power back and forth, the more things stay the same. If we are to have an opposition party position to balance out the move to the right on the part of the two major parties it is up to us, today, right now.
As long as the progressive community continues to bitch and moan during off years, but then goes running back to the Dems at election time, falling for their seductive come hither campaign promises, we'll never have anything close to a progressive voice in government. The Dems are just not progressive, yet they believe sincerely they OWN our votes and to vote for anyone else is to be branded with the heresy of SPOILER!! The scarlet S!
The fact is they already stack the electoral process against third party involvement in a most un-small-"d"-democratic way.
We need to change these unfair electoral rules, we need to amass a wave of popular sentiment for impeachment that will force them to get some backbone AS THEY PROMISED when they were given the Congress, and we need to get rid of some of them and elect more independents, Greens and other third party representatives to speak and act for us!
Hippie02:
As soon as I saw the name "Coniff," I thought the same thing: this is a woman who, along with her editor (Matthew Rothschild), has repeated the Dershowitz lie that Norm Finkelstein is a "Holocaust denier."
In fact, Finkelstein's father was a Holocaust survivor. I think readers of Common Dreams and other such sites should hold her and her boss to some accounting. They should also point out that Israel is a rogue state guilty of "ethnically cleansing" the Palestinians.
Robert: Thanks for posting the latest list of signors onto HR333. I noticed that we picked up another rep on the 24th from PA. I think a lot of folks were on the phone on Monday and Tuesday to their congress critters. Looks like they had an impact.
That said, let's stay focused here folks. The purpose of impeachment is the PROCESS, not just the removal from office. Conyer's must move HR333 out of the Judiciary Committee onto the House floor. It really is a conflict of interest for him to sign onto HR333. What we have to fight for is a public hearing of the evidence to bring impeachment in the House. Conyers is totally WRONG to be counting votes prior to the presentation of evidence on the floor of the House. His job is to get it to the floor. Get the damn thing (HR333) out of the Judiciary Committee!! It doesn't matter what the votes are before the evidence is heard!!
By the way, Kucinich is no dummy. The articles he presented in HR333 are airtight legally and have irrefutable evidence to back them up.
So get going. Write, e-mail, call your House congress critters. NOW! And keep at it until they sign on. Toll free at 866-338-1015, 800-459-1887 or 800-614-2803. You can reach Conyers office at these numbers as well. Just ask for any rep. you want and they will connect you.
Thanks for all you do.
People like Reid and Feingold say, "We don't need to tie up the House and Senate with an impeachment trial." Isn't this statement itself "political"?
Nichols is wrong. Conyers wantED to impeach . . . maybe. He certainly doesn't now. He's more interested in being loyal to Pelosi.
that is a new one on me...
That heinous crimes are not to be punished as long as SOME of the victims think they can gain from ignoring it.
"Mike Tyson raped and impregnated my daughter, but what the hell, I'm gonna have some athletic grandkids"
Could someone point out to me where this particular legal fantasy is written in the legal codes?
The old saw says "Whether you think you can, or think you can't, you're right."
Telling yourself "There aren't enough votes to remove Bush/Cheney" is a self-fulfilling prophecy. Bring the articles of impeachment and you'd see how fast the balance would change in favor of removing Bush. Some of the Repugs are too deep in the manure ever to emerge, but all it takes is a handful of pragmatists who recognize that their poliitcal survival no longer depends on the right-wing vomit machine.
Little discussions between colleagues don't change political equations -- action does.
The odds were much longer against the civil rights movement, and those involved put their bodies at risk, often losing their lives. The Dem leadership have hypnotized too long by their own consultants to remember that their power derives FROM THE PEOPLE, not from the party. The People will support & apply the pressure, but Conyers has to decide that he can ACT without getting permission to do so from the DLC's bank-rollers.
the dems have a few more months to keep my vote. otherwise, it's nader or a libertarian or a green or ANYONE but these lying liars who used our emotional outrage to get us into the streets; they scammed us out of the money in our wallets to help those in close elections; all in order to get themselves in power and then they shit on us. pelosi is the worst. she has got to go.
Article II, Section 4 of the Constitution states:
" The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, SHALL be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other High Crimes and Misdemeanors.
From American Hertigage Dictionary definition of SHALL:
In formal style, Americans use shall to express an explicit obligation, as in Applicants shall provide a proof of residence, though this sense is also expressed by must or should.
ptlbush:
The reason for impeaching is because it is the right thing to do, regardless of the possibilities of success. If you are a doctor deciding upon whether or not to do a heart operation on a 6-year-old child; and the alternative to the operation is that the child will die; then don't you do the operation? Even if the chances of success are small?
That is the situation we are facing here. We MUST impeach in an effort to stop these thieves from wreaking even more damage. Even if we don't have a good chance to succeed, our failure to try means there is NO CHANCE AT ALL to stop them.
All of you impeachment naysayers: Remember this when the nukes fall on Iran. You will be able to look in the mirror and see someone who helped make it happen. And when it happens, I will curse you every day of the remainder of my (probably short, like most everyone else's) life.
I agree with Rebel Farmer....wheather or not there are enough votes in the Senate to convict on Impeachment is besides the point..there is not even any requirement for the Senate to vote on the question.
The main reason impeachment is required is to get Bush's skinny ass into a chair in front of Congress to answer their questions UNDER OATH about the disasterous path he has lead the US, and his apperant crimes of TORTURE, LYING TO CONGRESS ABOUT THE REASONS FOR AN ILLEGAL WAR, UNCONSTITUTIONAL AND ILLEGAL WIRETAPPING OF AMERICANS (INCLUDING DEMOCRAT RIVALS NO DOUBT), REMOVAL OF HABEUS CORPUS...the list goes on and on
Remember who introduced HR 333, the Articles of Impeachment..with no member of Congress behind him..only US.
Kucinich 2008
There is no excuse not to impeach.
What can we do?
1. Call/email Congress
2. Collect signatures
3. Protest
4 Wear Orange on Fridays
There has to be more....what?
We all know that Democrats are not impeaching because, in their corrupt view, the process would hurt their chances of winning more seats in congress and the White House in 08. How many troops or civilians keep dying in Iraq is irrelevant. Impeachment requires a simple majority in the House, which Dems have.
The more troops that die, the better, more reasons to pile on Bush (not to mention that without Democrats' blessing Bush wouldn't be able to invade Iraq in the first place).
Now is the time for a Third Party. Democrats must be wiped off the electoral map as soon as humanly possible.
Why can't progressives support challengers to the Democrats in the primaries? There are some good people in the Democratic Party, Kucinich certainly, so why don't progressives focus on taking over the Democratic Party? Why this feel-good third-party stuff which reminds me of playing the lottery (history has shown it has about the same chance of success). The left has taken over the Democratic Party before and it can again. That is something real. Sheehan has the right idea.
In reading through this discussion one thing strikes me. That is, that the good and honest people who still believe in the democratic process are forgetting that the process of movements like impeachment will only happen when the democratic leadership is forced to move BECAUSE THERE IS A MASS MOVEMENT OF THE PEOPLE. So where are the massive protest rallies of the sixties and seventies? The answer is simple, we now live a country in which many people fear retribution by government, where dissent is dangerous, and it is not surprizing to me that few people seem to be willing to show their faces in opposition to the administration.
Since recent Polls show clearly that most people in America now feel impeachment is needed, what can be done in these times of fear that won't get you harrassed? Anyway, I recently heard about a movement of people PLEDGE TO IMPEACH.ORG, where people can use what is left of their democracy to pledge to participate in a "General Strike", (Don't go to work, don't buy anything, stay home) which they feel has a better chance at moving impeachment forward. What if tens of millions of people decided to get involved? I think it is worth a try, and similar things have worked in other countries! Let's face it, only when it becomes political suicide to have been one of "the protectors" will Pelosi and her bunch of sissy ass nincompoops do their DUTY.
Many, many people want to see Bush and Cheney's crimes punished. How can we say it's ok to sit back, wait, and play politics with what is happening in this country today? That is just an excuse.
The lying Democrats, as well as the Republicans, are on their way out, Nichols, get the picture. I voted the "lesser of two evils" scenario last time, and you know what? I should have voted for Nader. What is the use of voting for the system standing (or hobbling) as it is right now? LOOK AT ALL THIS BITCHING, dude. Get the point. We're sick of it.
Average Americans have less buying power, are prey to (legal!) predatory business practices, as our class divide grows, our schools are underfunded according to the laws passed by our very congress, our food is of questionable standards and is imported based on corrupt trade deals, our travel infrastructure goes under- or un-funded, asthma goes up with air pollution, our sons are killed in a pointless, illegal war, and our life expectancy wanes in comparison to other developed countries.
And our government, by sitting there signing pieces of paper, rains misery, not democracy, upon honest people who reside in places like Iraq and Afganistan.
I no longer want to be lied to and used by the two major parties in yet another election. I want alternatives.
ptlbush Why would I want 25 years of Dimocrapic corporate party control when they have sold out 100% to war profiteers and corporate globalists? Remember it was the Dims that gave us Vietnam and a million dead Iraqis under the Korporate Klinton Kontrol sanctions (do a google search for Haliday Iraq sanctions genocide).
Like many folks I get calls for donations... Yesterday for Obama and just now from Dennis.
Very simple... When they come out for Impeachment of Bush/Cheney together as partners in High Crimes (not really concerned with misdemeanors but I am sure there are many of them too) then I well be happy to donate.
Dennis knows that I disapprove of his tact of going after Cheney first because it is easier.
I sang and told about it at a rally for him in Tampa a few months back.
Nothing about the revolution is gonna be easy and as soon as he realizes that, I well donate.
The more these politicians learn that if they want our money, they can't support the War and these criminals who are destroying our country.
Love, Jim
Jim Glover: Actually, I approve of going after Cheney first. He's the real power behind the throne.
kival: You are absolutely spot on! The following comment by Earthian on another thread related to Cindy Sheehan running against Pelosi ties right into what you are saying:
Earthian July 25th, 2007 2:42 pm
To John:
John, you say of her bid to challenge Pelosi for her seat in the House ". . . presumably on an independent line." I think that is a very bad idea. There are many true progressives in the Democratic Party and the Green Party is full of true progressives. To abandon these two parties–the former with the infrastructure for progressive change and the latter with the ideology for progressive change, is to fail to build on progressive accomplishment of both. There are now over 20 state progressive caucuses in the Democratic Party. The Green Party is the only national progressive party.
To Cindy:
I urge you Cindy (and your supporters) not to wait until the general election to run against Pelosi as an independent. Run a two-step, two-party race. Run against her as a Democrat in the Primary. Then if you don't win, get on the Green Party ticket and run on their 2008 Progressive Platform against her in the general election for the House seat she currently disgraces. (The GP platform agrees with you on Iraq and foreign policy.) By working with both parties Cindy, you can get lots of support from true progressives in both parties–and support from the San Francisco progressive majority. Don't deprive San Francisco folks of the choice to vote for you in the Democratic Primary. Remember, San Francisco voters already voted to impeach Bush. With this plan progressive Democrats will get behind you. And the Green Party will not oppose you if you win the primary.
Great strategy! I believe that this strategy needs to be used in every district and in every State against ALL dems that have demonstrated that they do not progressively represent their constituants.
SOOOOOOO......! Look at your own Dem congress critters and figure out who can be put up against them in the primaries if they need to be removed. If Cindy can do it, we should make this a rallying cry across the nation for progressive Dems to take their party back!
Whatdayaallthink?
Corvo: Not only that! If bush goes first, Cheney becomes the prez. Bad scenerio.
Jim Glover: Give Dennis $50 bucks. He's earned it.
Democrats don't want to impeach King George because they are all assuming that Democrats will be in charge when bush is finally dragged out of the White House(that is if he does not declare a national emergency and declares himself dictator) kicking and screaming at the end of his term. Essentially, they don't want to rock the boat with impeachment proceedings. Heaven forbid if war criminals in Washington are brought to justice. How can they impeach a president when both Democrats and Republicans were accomplices in the "mad bomber's" assault on our Constitution? Not to mention the direct and brutal assault on sovereign weak countries that had no means of defending themselves.
The last thing they want to do is open the flood gates of democracy and let hard-working and tax-paying Americans take control of this country.
SkySonja says, "There has to be more...what?"
I've been reading everyone's posts and the news online. Right now all I can do is weep.
Maybe "Guns and Butter" on KPFA in Berkeley at 6pm Eastern will cheer me up.
Because it's becoming painfully and depressingly obvious that practically every member of the People's House and Senate have no interest in doing the job they were hired to do: "Defend and protect the United States Constitution against ALL enemies, both foreign and DOMESTIC." It must hurt for them to look in the mirror every morning. These are not STUPID people. They see the same news we do. They have to KNOW exactly what's going on, yet they sit there: "See no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil..."
There has to be a very good reason people like Feingold, Leahy, Boxer etc. are not speaking out forcefully to try to put the brakes on this runaway train! I keep racking my fried brain trying to understand...WHY IS NO ONE SPEAKING OUT AND TAKING DECISIVE ACTION?
I wrote my Rep. Jane Harman a long letter at least 2 weeks ago now and her office said it will take 6 weeks for a reply.
Many years ago a good political friend of mine tried to tell me, "Scratch a liberal and you'll find a fascist." So true. And so profoundly sad.
And one more realization before I submit this. Even if by some miracle we can stop this fascist runaway train, we will never be able to be complacent again. If a people have freedom and democracy they have to work every day to make sure nothing evil is lurking in the shadows to destroy it. Who said, "The price of liberty is eternal vigilance"?
The American people have been so busy watching "American Idol" and listening to "the powers that be" saying "Trust us...., " that we are now in the precarious and dangerous position of being on the runaway fascist train and those we've entrusted to have their hands on the emergency brake (the House and Senate) refuse to pull on the lever.
BTW SkySonja. Do we have to wear ORANGE on Fridays? I don't even own anything that is orange! How about BLACK?????? Seems more appropriate. And oh so NYC cool!
Canuckchuck: Absolutely right, the language of the constitution demands us to do our duty to our country and keep it free! I agree 100%.
To everybody who wants to stick with the Democratic Party: Remember, this is the party that dragged us into the American Civil War. The party that not only dragged us into WWI, but kept alive anti-immigration, anti-sedition, and anti-communist laws during the 1910s and 1920s.
At least when Andrew Johnson, Richard Nixon, and Bill Clinton were all going through either being impeached or being threatened with impeachment, the presidents stood by and did not interfere. I am afraid of what Bush might try to do should we start impeachment proceedings (dissolve Congress? a new state of emergency? another 9/11? martial law?).
We should limit the amount of representation one party can have in either house of Congress to 25 or 35%, to allow three or more parties to give a more accurate representation of the American public.
I for one hope that the Communist Party USA will once again start putting up presidential candidates, and that all the American Communist and Socialist parties will stop fighting amongst themselves and unite behind one Communist Party.
Oh...and don't vote libertarian. Worse than Republicans.
According to John Nichols, "Impeachment isn't a constitutional crisis. It's a cure for a constitutional crisis" and "The Founders said monarchical behavior -- the behaviour of a king, acting like one -- is an impeachable offense. You need not look for specific laws or statutes. What you need to look for is a pattern of behavior that says the presidency is superior not merely to Congress but to the laws of the land -- to the rule of law."
http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/video_popups/pop_vid_impeachment1-2.html
Using Campaign Spending Limits to Get America Better Politicians is the Only Way to Solve America's Problems Enough
"The history books will show we were vocal in condemning the President's abuses of power."
Hey, Senator, guess what the history books ALREADY show - that WE THE PEOPLE have been condemning the President's abuses of power for 6 f**king years! It's not a question whether impeachment will be successful or not, the point is to push this gang of pussies to the breaking point. They are unstable and on the ropes - now's the time to unleash our entire arsenal!!!
"Instead, they talk about getting on with the important business of the Congress, and not wasting time on impeachment."
And so when is this "getting on with the important business of the Congress" going to begin exactly?
The above article by Conniff is infuriating; it wouldn't merit addressing and replying to if it hadn't been reprinted in this forum. One wonders why such apology for inaction was deemed worthy of being published here.
1. The first thing that must be pointed about Conniff's article is that there is no imbroglio at all, i.e., the situation facing us is not confusing in the least, as is implied by the excellent comments entered above by baska, Karlof, Vern, HDune, Dichterfreund, Rebel Farmer, and canuckchuck. It is merely confusing to those who would like it to be so.
2. The second point is that Conniff's exclusive reliance on John Nichols as a voice on the topic of impeachment is utterly partial and self-serving: Nichols's ambivalence, already identified and exposed by baska above, is tailor-made for someone who aims to tell us that things are confusing and that, as such, we should go begging in piecemeal fashion to our mostly politically. morally, and juridically challenged and confused representatives.
In order to remedy the partiality of Conniff's lone source in the debate about impeachment, one should note at least the following other contributions to the discussion:
Michael Ratner, ed., Articles of Impeachment (Center for Constitutional Rights)
Elizabeth de la Vega (former federal prosecutor), (I) "A Fraud Worse than Enron," 11/27/06, www.truthout.org
--------------------, (II) "The Indictment: United States v. George W. Bush et al.," 11/29/06, www.truthout.org
--------------------, (III) "The Grand Jury Testimony: U.S. v. George Bush et al.," 11/30/06, www.truthout.org
This three-part article's contents can also be found in Vega's book United States v. George W. Bush et al. (Seven Stories Press, 2006).
Elizabeth Holtzman, "Impeaching Bush to Preserve the Constitution," 11/14/06, www.truthout.org
------------------, "Impeachment: The Case in Favor," 1/26/07, Common Dreams
Dave Lindorff, The Case for Impeachment, www.thiscantbehappening.net
3. The third thing that needs to be said loudly and clearly is that impeachment proceedings would not tie up the House and the Senate, as evidenced by previous such proceedings. To his credit, Nichols also makes that point. There is no historical precedent to support such diversionary and thereby phony "concerns."
(Incidentally, isn't remarkable that just as the calls for impeachment are becoming louder and more numerous, national health insurance is cited as an issue that would be eclipsed by impeachment proceedings by politicians who never even so much as dreamed about national health insurance, let alone advocated its implementation in public utterances?)
Quite the opposite is the case: it is politicians such as Feingold, who propose to correct Bush the Lesser's crimes of mass murder and of taking the nation to war by deception and lies by striking his fingers with a ruler, who are tying up the House, the Senate, and the nation.
These pusillanimous politicians are tying up the Senate and the House, and the nation, because they are tying us up in the quagmire of the unitary executive, a euphemistic expression for a proto-dictatorial regime.
4. This last point brings me to what is the most important motivation for the current calls for impeachment proceedings. This point was made by Elizabeth Holtzman in her above cited article "Impeaching Bush to Preserve the Constitution." What is at stake with Bush and Cheney's domestic and international machinations -- all examples of outlaw behavior -- is none other the Constitutional structure of the United States, and, I would add, its standing as a law abiding nation among nations. That is why all the empirical worries are irrelevant. Impeachment at this bleak moment in the history of the nation is a matter of jus, of right, not of facts and factual considerations.
Even if an impeachment trial were to tie up Congress and even if impeachment did not remove Bush from the presidency or force him out, as it did Nixon, the commitment to the Constitution compels one to carry out the trial, as canuckchuck has pointed out above. It is that simple. The only reason why impeachment is not more readily embraced by members of Congress in the face of the massive crimes and corruption of the Bush corporate regime is that so many of them have already very tragically lost that commitment or fail to see that the actions of BushCo are eroding the Consitution and constitute precedents for further erosion in the future.
5. If Pelosi and Conyers can oppose and prevent impeachment proceedings, they can just as well initiate them, can they not? They are not supposed to have votes prior to the impeachment trial. Before one may vote on the impeachment of Bush and Cheney, one must present the evidence in favor of impeachment. As such, Pelosi and Conyers are to enable the opening of the proceedings, namely, the hearings on the evidence for impeachment (here is where facts come into play).
Good one, EveningLand. Facts are compelling. The Constitution requires all of us to act.
We are also duty bound to disobey and ignore all acts contrary to the guarantees afforded us by the Constitution