EMAIL SIGN UP!
Most Popular This Week
- Corporate Win: Supreme Court Says Monsanto Has 'Control Over Product of Life'
- Cornel West: Obama 'Is a War Criminal'
- Patent Filing Claims Solar Energy ‘Breakthrough’
- Disaster Capitalism Strikes as Hedge Funds Circle Near-Bankrupt Municipalities Like Vultures
- Ignoring Bee Crisis, EPA Greenlights New 'Highly Toxic' Pesticide
Popular content
Today's Top News
The RX From "SiCKO:" More Choice
The pundits are working overtime trying to defuse the message from "SiCKO," Michael Moore's new film. They are trying to convince the public that the United States could not possibly do what every other rich country (and even some not so rich countries) have managed to do: guarantee their people decent health care.
The centerpiece of the pundits' whine is that universal health care could not work here. They claim the systems which work in other countries require a larger roll for government in health care than Americans want. While this claim is contradicted by poll after poll on the topic, we don't have to argue with the pundits, rather pointless task in any case.
We can just give people a choice and let them vote with their feet. Suppose the government were to establish a Medicare-type program and open it up to all individuals and employers in the country. Those who already have insurance can switch to the government-run plan. Similarly, employers can switch to it as well. Individuals who do not already have insurance would have the option of buying in to the expanded Medicare plan as would employers who do not currently provide insurance for their workers. We can also have a system of expanded subsidies for health care for low and moderate income households, which will make health care insurance more affordable for those families.
This is more or less what both John Edwards and Barack Obama have proposed in their presidential campaigns. To get to universal coverage, there are important issues like mandating that individuals have health care insurance, and also questions about the revenue source for subsidies, but the key point is to establish a national Medicare-type insurance system that can get costs under control and eliminate the enormous waste in the private insurance system.
Medicare's administrative expenses are a small fraction of the administrative expenses of private insurers. Medicare uses just 2 percent of the money that flows through the system to cover administrative costs. By contrast, private insurers spend between 10 to 20 percent of their premiums to cover administrative costs. They use this money for marketing, high CEO salaries and dividends to shareholders; all expenses that Medicare does not have.
This is the reason Medicare always wipes the floor when it competes against private insurers on a level playing field. That is exactly what happened in the late 90s when the "Medicare Plus Choice" program was restructured to remove most of the subsidy for the private insurers that participated in the program. The vast majority of the HMO's that had entered the Medicare system went running for shelter, whining that they could not make a profit if they were only compensated as much per patient as the traditional Medicare program.
This is why when the Republican Congress wanted to expand the role of private insurers in Medicare with the 2003 Medicare Modernization Act: They put in a system of subsidies that the Medicare Payment Advisory Board estimates at 12 percent per beneficiary. The insurers again claim they could not possibly make a profit if they got the same per patient fees as the traditional Medicare program.
This experience is important. We cannot afford universal health care if we don't bring the costs of the US system more in line with the rest of the world. We currently pay more than twice as much per person, with no obvious benefit in terms of outcome. The key to creating a more efficient system is to have a government-run system comparable to the traditional Medicare system.
But, we don't have to pontificate about American values and the role of government - leave the silly pseudo-philosophical debates out of it. This is a straight dollars-and-cents question that can be determined by the market. Give people a choice and let them decide whether they want to be insured through the government-run system or want to stick with private health care providers.
The pundits have managed to flip reality on its head. It is the health insurance industry and their partners-in-crime, the pharmaceutical industry, that are scared of the market and competition.
If we just allow a government-run plan to compete on a level playing field with private insurers, we can soon get a system of universal health care. The question for the insurance-industry-loving pundits is: "What's wrong with giving people a choice?"
Dean Baker is the co-director of the Center for Economic and Policy Research (CEPR). He is the author of The Conservative Nanny State: How the Wealthy Use the Government to Stay Rich and Get Richer ( www.conservativenannystate.org). He also has a blog, "Beat the Press," where he discusses the media's coverage of economic issues. You can find it at the American Prospect.
Comments
Note: Disqus 2012 is best viewed on an up to date browser. Click here for information. Instructions for how to sign up to comment can be viewed here. Our Comment Policy can be viewed here. Please follow the guidelines. Note to Readers: Spam Filter May Capture Legitimate Comments...

20 Comments so far
Show AllI saw Michael Moore's documentary "Sicko" Sunday night, and it made me want to move to Europe.
With all it's friendly people, apparent surplus, and natural beauty, the US as a nation seems to lack a basic human idea over which I personally part the barbarians from the civilized nations. It's the concept of solidarity beyond just the narrow tribe, and it's the lack of knowledge that such solidarity is proven to work well for the good of (just about) all in a great many modern societies. I am not saying the concept of solidarity does not exist here, it's just underdeveloped, but there is documented evidence that it has been actively driven out by the relentless and conscious efforts of a ruthless business PR machinery that has pushed a 'me, me, me' and 'winner takes all attitude' in its stead. (This push started in the waning days of WWII, for more read Alex Carey: Taking the Risk Out of Democracy, Corporate Propaganda versus Freedom and Liberty).
What prompted my acidic post is the following, quite typical uttering by a right winger in a discussion forum about Michael Moore's indictement of the US healthcare system:
"But socialized single payer health care is not the answer for anything. If people think it's appropriate that you subsidize the costs of someone else's healthcare, they should open up their checkbook and start paying other people's bills. Leave the rest of us alone."
What is stunning to me is that apparently the idea of solidarity within society is openly rejected even at its most basic level on entirely ideological grounds.
Consider:
Anybody over the age of twelve should have seen enough of life to know that perfectly healthy people can become bedridden, crippled or debilitated with or without their own doing in no time, or in stages. Tomorrow, it might be you, or your mother.
That is why many societies have put systems into place to ease hardship for individuals by evenly distributing the burden of sickness onto society as a whole. And it's not a theory, it's a practice. Michael Moore shows his fellow Americans examples of health care systems that work pretty well at guaranteeing that anybody who needs care gets care, in both comparably wealthy and much poorer states. In other words, the ideological statement quoted above is patently false:
Socialized single payer health care systems are proven, practical ways of providing modern, high quality care to everybody.
The American citizenry, meanwhile, in its befuddled state of cluelessness, over-work, depression, distractedness and criminal jingoism has failed to notice what is there for anyone to see.
That said, there are billions of propaganda dollars spent annually by profiteering industries (many of them artificial subdivisions that would not exist in a system that prioritized care over profit syphoned off for care-unrelated 'services'), and they keep this scared, propagandized, and demoralized population in check.
What exactly are American celebrating on the Fourth of July? Whatever it is, it can't be their 'independence', because they have none. I guess it's their new stainless steel grill, bought with the n'th credit card that tethers them ever tighter to their debtor's prison.
Go watch Sicko. It's being demonized as 'propaganda'. Because it proves that things could be organized for the good of the people, instead of to their detriment. If it it hurts to realize that you've been conned you have two options. One of them is denial, often accompanied by trying to shoot the messenger.
Another word about my incendiary remark about 'criminal jingoism'. One additional (but not necessary!) reason why the US has no humane, effective health care system is that it is an empire that is prioritizing unimaginable resources for global military domination, namely a war & 'defense' budget larger than that of all other nations combined (2003 figures. Yes, lower figures can be conveniently doctored but they remain lies as they purposefully 'overlook' huge domains of the institutional war machine). Obviously, money sucked away into this abyss is not easily reassigned to civilian needs.
One old ploy of the people in power is to pretend that things are necessarily the way they are, that no alternatives are viable, and that things are 'in the right hands'. In some ways, such deception should become harder, as a view over the fence has become as easy as turning on an internet computer. And yet, the instruments of propagandizing the masses have also evolved. I'll be curious how this one turns out.
Suggestion: put those flags away, paint picket signs and let those who deceive you know that you're wizening up.
Great post Quark. The French may have to build a fence.
I have no problem with the private insurers trying to sell their policies on a level playing field. HR 676 is the only bill put forward that creates that level playing field. Edwards pretends his plan does, but he's not being straight with us.
Dean Baker helped establish the funding for HR 676. It's well thought out, fair, and actually provides cadillac coverage while costing less than what we are putting up with right now. Thank you, Dean Baker.
You can go to the following website and see exactly where the money will come from: http://www.healthcare-now.org/resources/financing_hr676.htm The website has a link to the home website so you can read and drool over the coverage we are entitled to and aren't getting - INCLUDING DENTAL! (unless, of course, you happen to be a Congressperson, then you get it all for life - and WE pay for it)
By the way, are these rightwingers raving against single payer health care happy about supporting our corrupt politicians' medical bills?
Actually, I'm headed for the south of France in July via Germany. There are actually no borders, except if I go through Switzerland. Mindboggling, really, considering the mass graves throughout Europe from internecine warfare and extermination. Progress happens where nationalism recedes.
Take the profit out of the US health care system. Eliminate the private insurance companies, and make it a single payer universal system. No other system will work. Money is the root of all evils.
It's amazing that anyone believes that we aren't paying for other people's medical bills and insurance under the current for-profit system. Somehow it escapes the understanding of the wingnut mentality that whenever corporations make a profit, we all pay for it.
When we pay twice as much for health care as other developed countries, We the People pay for it. When insurance companies make windfall profits, it's because our premiums are completely out of sync with income or even inflation. In the 20 years that I have been paying for my health insurance - not to mention what my employer has put into it, I have not nearly used as much for my doctor bills as I have paid into the insurance. That's what insurance does; it's a collective system that makes us pay for what other people use, unless we are the ones unlucky enough to get very sick or injured. Even then, as pointed out in Sicko, many people with insurance still go into debt to pay medical bills.
When a collective system makes a profit, it's called "paying your own way" by rightwingers, but when a collective system simply provides for everyone by way of the government, it's called "socialism" or "getting other people to pay your way for you."
Personally, I'd rather have a responsible government run social programs - which is what health care is - than a corporation interested in nothing but the bottom line. Even education is better run by the government than by private organizations. (The Edison schools, for example, have been a failure for the most part.)
That old Ronald Reagan saying, "I'm from the government and I'm here to help" followed by gales of laughter from the right has damaged our government's ability to do almost anything well. How in the world can people who don't believe in government do a good job running the government? Oh. That's right. They can't.
From the article "...require a larger roll for government in health care..." What do you mean - a baguette? A granary bap? Come on CD - in the CIA article you have confused 'lose' with 'loose' - does anyone proof your copy other than spellcheck? There's lots of good writing here, but you do lose credibility if you keep make school-level mistakes in your articles. Harumph!
Unfortunately, it would not be a level playing field. The insurance companies would dump all their sick patients into the government system, so the government system could not compete. (I'm assuming the government system would have to insure anyone, otherwise what difference would it make?) It's OK to have private insurance available (as in Britain), but it is essential for everybody, including all those healthy people, to participate in the government system whether they choose to go private or not.
LeeAnnG said: "a corporation interested in nothing but the bottom line"
But it is worse: corporation have a legal obligation to their shareholders to maximise profit. That's why we must take health care out of the domain of corporations, or no change can be effective. That profit mandate is the biggest obstacle to a livable world, period.
Please remember, the health care crisis in this country is not the fault of the doctors, hospitals, or healthcare workers. They are being abused as much as the rest of us are. They should keep their incomes worthy of their knowledge and skills if we just get Wall Street overlords out of the way of decent, doctor directed care. In California we have Senate Bill 840 which most of our legislators are for but Arnold won't sign it.
There is movement in other states. See One Care Now http://www.onecarenow.org/index.html.
This is what I posted in the Burbank Democratic Club Blog yesterday http://burbankdemocraticclub.blogspot.com:
See Sicko Soon! Why is our system as sick as it is?
We saw Michael Moore's Sicko this weekend. You need to see it soon and get everyone you know to see it, too. And get them to insist everyone they know goes to see it.
Then we need to completely change this country's health care system from what it is, a protection racket run by gangster insurance and pharmaceutical thugs that bleed us all dry under inflated and false fears of socialism, to what it actually is in 24 of the other 25 industrialized nations, a reasonable, non-financial public service that everyone shares and benefits from equally. Just like libraries, police, fire, and schools, it's a social utility.
Americans have been constantly lied to about socially beneficial programs so that obscene profits could be maintained while we suffer physically and economically. Americans who don't visit other countries have been easily swayed that things elsewhere are horrifying. So, under the wrong kind of winner-take-all capitalism, what you might also call lottery economics, instead of heartfelt, democratic, progressive capitalism, Americans have voted to keep the wealth abusers' freedom to cause pain instead of curtailing their damage to us. It's time for that to stop.
Although the issue is nonpartisan, even among our Democratic presidential candidates only Dennis Kucinich supports single payer government run universal health care. That the front runners are still beholden to insurance and pharmaceutical lobbies is disturbing, at the least. Yes, we want the war to end, and will respond to that, but we need also to get free of the robber baron feudalism that is draining all hope in America.
I, for one, demand of my party and its representatives that we stand for nothing less than full single payer health care. We need to shout about this, march about it, make it happen.
See the movie, and among its many great examples, notice the look on the face of a woman whose inhaler costs $120.00 in the US as she discovers it would cost only a nickel in another country. See especially the looks on the faces of many people from other countries in the movie as they try to figure out how Americans could have such an absurd profit driven system as we do. It really doesn't make sense to them.
Why does it to us?
as necessary as it is to make access to healthcare equitable, that alone will not dramatically effect the nation's health. health also includes other things: access to healthy food, access to leisure time, freedeom from excessive stress.
once you look at health from a larger perspective than just access to medical care, you might begin to question the whole notion of a "profit system." industrialized food, employment insecurity, excessive debt necessitating multiple jobs, the cost of worrying about education, retirement, etc., etc.
human need before human greed: www.wsws.org
Kathyodat makes a good point. The Conyers bill does have the potential to cover the uninsured (why should the health care industry care since these poor souls are not ever going to be their clients anyway?) and the rest of us with something more comprehensive and less expensive than anything private industry can provide.
As the subscribers grow private health will become a quaint anachronism as the government is able to demand price concessions from pharma, hospitals, and other ancillary services. With a level playing field it will be like the world series champs taking on a t-ball team.
One other angle to consider here is staying healthy in the first place. Our bodies have evolved over millions of years around our existence as hunter/gatherers, yet in the last hundred or so years we have moved completely away from that diet so it is no wonder that some of our fundamental biological processes are no longer functioning properly. Here are six quite straightforward practical suggestions that can be easily followed without too much disruption to your day to day life.
1) First become aware of, and then look to hugely reduce your intake of white sugar. It has no nutritional value other than as a carbohydrate, in fact your body has to give up certain elements to metabolise this unnatural substance, so it strips nutrition from your body. This includes stripping calcium from your teeth, so not only does plaque metabolise sugar into acid attacking the tooth externally, it also weakens it internally. That carbohydrate is almost certainly not needed of course, so it is laid down as fat contributing to the myriad of health problems associated with obesity. Perhaps the most serious aspect of this is that white sugar depresses the immune system. The surge of sugar into the blood stream (that does not happen with unrefined sugars which break down in the gut much more slowly) causes the pancreas to flood the bloodstream with insulin which prevents the immune system from functioning effectively. So the more white sugar you consume, the more likely you are to fall ill. And that's not even taking into account the ever increasing incidences of diabetes, which is directly related to high levels of sugar consumption. If you eat processed food you are eating white sugar, so look to reduce that. For that sweet craving, honey and fruit not only act perfectly well as a substitute, they actually have nutritional benefit as well, and if you are thirsty on a hot day remember that Coca Cola has the equivalent of 12 sugar cubes in each tin, and that it takes quite a bit of water to metabolise the sugar, so if you are thirsty drink fruit juice (not "fruit drink" which will have added sugar) or water.
2) Not only does processed food have high levels of white sugar in it, but also high levels of sodium chloride (common salt). This can lead to hypertension and can cause renal problems. As with sugar, first work out how much salt you're taking, and then look to significantly reduce it.
3) Far and away the best way to stay healthy is to rely on your incredible immune system. Vitamin C is essential to maintain it at full efficiency, and as the body cannot retain Vitamin C you need to be putting some in every day. Not in tablet form, just eat at least one piece of citrus fruit a day.
4) The world is full of naturally occurring pathogens, and our immune system can deal with nearly all of them. I don't know exactly when disinfectant was invented, but on our evolutionary scale it was in the last few seconds. Don't be afraid of dirt! Particularly, don't try and surround your child in an antiseptic bubble, because without the pathogens getting into their system the immune system will not know what to do when they are older and pathogens get in there, as they will. Let your kids play in the dirt, don't freak if they put an earthworm in their mouth (I can clearly remember doing that as a three year old - and it didn't kill me!) but allow them to experience the world as children have for million of years so their immune system will get strong and help keep them well for all their life. In the UK one in seven children suffer from asthma. This was thought to be an effect of air pollution (and I'm sure that doesn't help) but incidences of the condition are not consistent with air pollution levels, so it is now believed that when children grow up in too sterile an environment their immune system, unable to do the job it is there to do, starts turning inward and attacking the host body tissue. Germs, in reasonable amounts, are a good thing for you.
5) Coronary disease is still the single biggest killer in the west, and saturated fat is the biggest single cause of that. Really the best thing is to stop eating the main source i.e. meat, but if you don't want to do that, I would recommend you cut down your meat input. As hunter/gatherers meat was an occasional part of the diet depending on seasonal availability of game plus being able to actually catch something - hunting mammoths with a stone tied to the end of a stick was a pretty parlous exercise, so picking nuts, fruits and berries was a much netter option. Our evolved digestive system reflects that, and digesting meat is not easily done (particularly red meat, which takes about two weeks to fully digest) and it places stress on the alimentary system which has to operate at maximum level to deal with it. It's no coincidence that stomach and bowel cancers occur predominantly in the West (so much so they are dubbed the 'affluence diseases') and that correlates directly with levels of meat consumed. Once a child in the West is weaned it often eats meat several times a day, every day for the rest of their life. Their digestive system is permanently 'fully on', it never gets a rest. It was not designed to do that so it's hardly surprising that things start going wrong. As adults we only need about 50 grams of protein a day, any excess our gut breaks down with difficulty into carbohydrate (more fat) or pass it through (I would imagine the average American turd is very protein rich) so reducing your protein intake might not be a bad idea anyway. So to sum up, if you don't want to stop eating meat. cut down the amount you eat. Have days where you don't eat it to give your digestive system a bit of a break, and cut out the crap meat (just think what a Big Mac looks like before the colouring, flavouring, stabilisers, preservatives etc. are added - a splodge of grey gloop that would make you throw up if you saw it) and use the money saved to buy some good quality meat, preferably organic (it's not hard to understand that you would be better off eating a cow that spent it's life in a field eating grass rather than one in a shed pumped full of growth hormones and antibiotics eating god knows what (sheep's brains - well hello BSE!).
6) 70% of car journeys in the US are under three miles. Walk! A bit of daily exercise - come on that's obvious surely!
It is simple stuff, and it shows how disconnected we have become that such things even need to be said, but if you follow the above you will a) feel healthier generally and b) get ill less often.
This is interesting. I just went to the Healthcare-now website, and it states the following about HR 676:
Private health insurers shall be prohibited under this act from selling coverage that duplicates the benefits of the USNHI program. Exceptions to this rule include coverage for cosmetic surgery, and other medically unnecessary treatments. Those who are displaced as the result of the transition to a non- profit health care system are the first to be hired and retrained under this act.
So Dean Baker is suggesting we change the law. Why would he do that? Everyone would be paying into the national system anyway, so insureds would be paying twice. And getting - gold star treatment? Special insurance hospitals with gourmet meals? Maybe on hospital yachts? Heaven forbid they might have to mingle with the hoi polloi. Or wait their turn in a waiting room.
Dean Baker's proposal is so clear, simple and forthright, maybe even your average Congressman will be able to grasp it. Make sure they all get a copy.
Once again the dialogue is long with rhetoric and jingoism on BOTH SIDES!!! Where is there any discussion about a solution to the problem? Government run health WILL NEVER WORK. The govt can't even run itself under either Party. This does not mean the current private system is working either. However, there is very little discussion about solutions, only pontificating about who is right and wrong. Frankly, I do not understand Dean Bakers proposal or how it will possibly be funded. I have not read the actual proposal but just in the article above does nothing to really explain it to simple folks like me.
What does single payer mean anyway? I'm already the single payer for my health care if I'm self employed or unemployed. Why is that? Why are there no more nurses in schools where all our children are each day? Does this have anything to do with govrrnment run health care in the future?
If there is to be a simple solution for this it would need to come from the people who understand health care the most, doctors, nurses, and health care workers. Does anyone really think a govt run system will not be rife with corruption and theft by corporate providers. Just look at the bidding process for "rebuilding" Iraq. That all happened while Demnocrats simply watched and did nothing. So you cannot blame Republicans solely for the past 7 years. Do you think a supplier of medical equipment will not drool at the thought of no bid contracts for a govt run system? I can hear it now, 'sorry folks, but due to the rising costs of health care, taxes will be going up to cover it'.
People need to wake up to the fact that we already pay plenty in taxes but the taxes we pay do not go to services for the people but private corporations who purportedly provide the services. If you look at Europe, yes they pay more taxes than we do, but they get far more services and better services than we do in the US. The real difference is in defense spending. If the US spent the same oin defense as say the UK, and eliminated our corporate welfare system, we would have plenty of money to fix our education system and health care system and pay off our debt to China who is financing our current wars.
We need to first look at the amount of taxes our government collects and the examine in detail how the money is doled out. If you have never really looked at this in detail before, be prepared to hit the floor in shock. The US spends more in corporate subsidies than most nations combined. In defense spending we far outspend ALL other nations combined and the troops get none of it while Congress votes for their own raise yearly. The other problem I have is this constant use of one single issue like health care as a wedge issue from both or either side (and it is done all over this page) as if the issues are not all interelated in the terms of taxes being collected to pay for them, one way or another, whether you agree or disagree.
Sicko may bring the issue of health care to the fore of national conversation, but does it offer any solutions? It seems like more grand standing to me, this time from the left. Got any solutions Mike? We all know what the problems are...
You've defined our biggest problem, neoconned. Our corporate welfare system. I believe the only way to end that is with publicly financed elections. But we have a Congress addicted to corporate money and refusing to get sober.
So we have to do it ourselves. And thanks to our prescient founders of the Constitution and Mike Gravel's work, we have the National Initiative to do it. But we need to get a LOT of signatures. And yesterday when I was out running errands, I asked employees at various shops if they had seen SiCKO, and they had never even heard of it. At first, I went home discouraged, feeling like America is a lost cause, the public has been lobotomized. But then I decided we have to get to work. I talked (by email) with Michael Grant of The Democracy Foundation and he will set up a PDF file for tracking signatures collected by hand and mailed to him. I'm going to ask him if there is a FAX number as well (cheaper for me). Fact sheet handout flyers can be given to people. Letters to the editor do have an impact. I've done grassroots work, and it's how things get done. But it's hard slow work. There is no easy quick fix.
The good news is the tide of public opinion is turning and Bush is helping to accelerate that turn with his arrogant belligerent behavior.
We've got to stop Ron Wyden. He's unrolled an insurance plan (S334) requiring every American to buy insurance which looks like the Massachusetts model with bells and whistles. Healthy Americans Private Insurance (HAPI) plans will allow people to buy insurance from companies who agree not to exclude preexisting conditions, guarantee portability, and focus on wellness. The government will subsidize people below the poverty level and partially subsidize on a sliding scale up to 400% of the poverty level. Whenever anyone interacts with the government in any way, such as enrolling children in school, getting a driver's license, whatever, they must show proof of health insurance. People will continue to pay premiums to insurers. There are also "personal responsibility contributions" to health care providers in this plan. I haven't been able to determine what that means except perhaps "copays"? Late enrollment penalties include all missed monthly premiums plus 15%. Bankruptcies will not discharge premium or personal responsibility contribution debts. It appears that we will still support the 2 million employees paid to deny service for various excuses. That doesn't appear to be addressed in Wyden's plan which appears full of loopholes for the insurance industry to exploit. Cost savings seems based primarily on the government coordinating reimbursement to care providers as far as I can tell. Every state must offer at least two insurance companies in each state who are providing this insurance. Otherwise, it's business as usual in the health care insurance industry. And in this plan, NO DENTAL!
This dreck makes me think of the line in SiCKO where a Frenchman points out a major difference between Americans and the French. "In America the people are afraid of the government. In France, the government is afraid of the people."
Support HR 676 and Dennis Kucinich if you want Universal (aka single payer) health care.
And Please spare me the tips on how to be healthy. It's the Republican idea that whatever our problems are they are all of our own making. So, I should have picked parents that would not give me the genetics I have to have 2 chronic illnesses..which caused me to not be able to work, which caused me to have no health insurance, which caused both coniditons to get out of control. All my own fault so I deserve to die. Let's leave that thinking and all the Republicans behind.
My suggestion to neoconned is to watch the movie - which will answer most of your questions. You can also read HR 676, it isn't very long and as to paying, the most important thing to understand is that we can actually pay for HR 676 with what we would save by passing it - and avert the coming medicare crisis. http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d109:h.r.00676: