Hey y´all, I was once a us citizen got an education worked and now I live in my ¨own¨country. Yeah, I got good education, saved up some money, ´cause I had a great job. I now work as a VP and thanks to the great USA. I was or used to say I was a us citizen got way up in my company, was able to received a college degree from a well known school in L A. Well, I guess I was smart enough to leave all this crappy life behind. I no longer need is because I now have a great life back in my country....God Bless America...

Hey y´all, I was once a us citizen got an education worked and now I live in my ¨own¨country. Yeah, I got good education, saved up some money, ´cause I had a great job. I now work as a VP and thanks to the great USA

Bob K,

Perhaps I should spell it out more clearly. US political, ecomomic and military policy displaces people. Is this the only problem in the world or the only problem that needs to be discussed when understanding migration? No--that is not my point.

My point is simply that mamy of those who have migrated here have done so because their homelands have, in many cases been destroyed and this destruction is directly related to the generation of great wealth that very few people benefit from. If we are to have a dialogue about migration than we need to address what forces people to migrate and cross borders to survive.

As for the name calling ('twisted moralist')--I don't really see that being useful in terms of creating dialogue.

directdemocracy

Fix the problem of the illegal immigrants? Simple. Raise the minimum wage to a level that will support someone above the poverty level and then have the the guest workers in any guest worker program paid that minimum wage by law. Presto! Problem solved.

Additionally, we could fire Lou Dobbs.

A. J. Dupre

I'm coming to this discussion very late, but I've just read all the posts and want to say I truly appreciate the thoughtful and informed comments about corporate insourcing of low-wage replacement workers. (Let's call it what it is.)

This is especially heartening because CommonDreams readers are most likely progressives, yet a lopsided majority strongly oppose corporate insourcing. I hope all you good progressives will be contacting both Mother Jones and your Congress members, and telling them you're against corporate insourcing and amnesty. It's a shame that so many Republican-lite Democratic politicians and even so-called "progressive" Democratic politicians are kissing corporate ass. Even worse, as AdeleTheCzech has said, "Now even Mother Jones is selling out low-income working families!"

Thank you AdeleTheCzech for pointing out that Mother Jones' claim that "these 12 million undocumented workers . . . are vital to the profits of American agribusiness," is "the same snake oil Corporate America keeps spewing. We're supposed to care about the profits of AGRIBUSINESS?"

Thank you Yellow Horse, for saying "I would prefer to pay more for my lettuce, and chicken breasts, and avoid cheating some fellow American out of a decent living."

Thank you JerryfromTijuana, for adding that "If the immigrants left . . . whatever [extra] you pay for the lettuce will be more than offset by what you are no longer paying for schools, emergency rooms, incarceration, and all the myriad other costs illegal immigration imposes on the economy."

Thank you wdmax3, for saying "Take away the immigrant worker (illegal or not) and farmers will be forced to innovate and improve," and "nannies, janitors, restaurant workers and other unskilled jobs will be done by the same unskilled American workers that used to do them."

Thank you JerryfromTijuana for reminding us that (if the illegals left) "unskilled American Citizens might find a way to use a job like a unionized janitor gig to climb into the middle class. Like they once were able to do."

Thank you phelicks for sharing this truth: "The farmers in my area will not hire Americans . . . Instead they tell our kids who are fresh out of school that they're overqualified to do the work, or they already have enough workers." And why? "Their #1 fear they claim is the potential of union organization."

And phelicks adds "none of them are paying any income, SS or medicare tax on their wages and the farmers are not paying into the unemployment system either."

Thank you again JerryfromTijuana for telling Dixie, that her "most Anglos are not accustomed to working in this heat" rationalization is "almost an exact paraphrase of the original justifications in the 17th Century for bringing African slaves to Virginia," and for pointing out that "illegal Mexicans . . . coming from the highlands of Oaxaca, Chiapas, or the central area around Mexico City," are also not used to the heat.

Thank you randall_burns for telling Dixie "I'm really not willing to accept the problems associated with mass immigration just so you can hire yard workers at $15/hour instead of $30/hour."

Thank you Dan Dorn, for reminding us that the low-wage replacement workers are not just lettuce pickers and construction workers: "Is it fair for an American to invest thousands of dollars and years of time and hard work to prepare for a career that will not be there, because it has been given to a foreign worker here on a visa who will accept lower wages? This is exactly what happened in The Information Technology field."

And thank you again, Dan, for this simple truth: "The fight is not against immigrants at all, it is against the manipulation of the American labor supply by big business and our government . . . It is about Americans protecting their right to work and support their families."

Thank you again JerryfromTijuana for this first-hand observation of life in Mexico's villages: "There is nothing more disheartening than driving through a village in Zacatecas or Michoacan where NO ONE works, VERY FEW men are about, and everybody waits for the money transfers to hit each week."

Thank you matthood for this insight: "Allowing 13 millions illegals to stay in America because of the deliberate incompetence of our officials—and allowing corporate america to destroy labor by bribing congress—is fascism by default."

Thank you again Yellow Horse for suggesting we "make it a felony to hire someone who does not have the proper ID."

Yellow Horse's suggestion leads me to my own comments. As I've said before in another thread (http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/08/1044/) and elsewhere, the solution to corporate insourcing of low-wage replacement workers is to fine and jail the criminal employers, and stop providing public benefits to the illegal migrants. If an employer claims "we didn't know" our 3,000 non-English speaking workers on the factory floor were illegal, that employer should get the same consideration a motorist gets when he tells a highway patrol officer he "didn't know" he was speeding.

You start with the largest criminal corporations, and work your way down to the smaller employers, and then finally to the individuals employing illegal migrant gardeners, etc. Of course the fines and criminal penalties have to be harsh enough to change these criminal employers' behavior. As a bonus, the fines will more than pay for the costs of enforcement.

Do that, and criminal employers across the country will get the message and begin terminating their illegal employees. With no jobs and no public benefits, the illegals will voluntarily return home (where they can live well on the U.S. dollars they've accumulated). We don't need to deport anybody. Let them pay their own travel costs. They can drive across the border in daylight, safely and without fear, and stay together in whatever groups or families they choose.

My solution works, doesn't cost taxpayers anything, doesn't require militarizing the border, treats the low-wage replacement workers humanely, and puts the blame where it belongs: on the criminal corporations and other criminal employers.

Of course, under-employed and underpaid American workers will rejoice, including blue-collar workers, teen job seekers and college students trying to earn their way through college. But so will the honest employers who have been forced to compete with criminal competitors and their wage slaves.

All of these employers will have to compete for employees in a smaller pool of available workers, which means they will have to offer better wages and benefits. Among the many positive consequences, working moms who would rather stay home and raise their children will once again have that option when one income is enough to support a family—as it used to be in the decades before corporate insourcing.

The argument that prices will rise because wages rise is mostly false. It's the same argument Republicans make whenever someone suggests raising the minimum wage. The studies have shown that raising wages for low-wage earners does not correlate to higher prices. In fact, there is a net positive effect on the overall economy. It's called the "trickle-up" theory, and it's the opposite of the now discredited "trickle-down" theory first popularized by Ronald Reagan.

The trickle-up theory says that when low-wage earners make more, they spend it immediately—on food, shelter, clothing, etc. This new spending circulates in the local economy, boosting many businesses and their related suppliers, and ultimately causing them to spend more money on expansions and new employees, and then THAT new spending circulates in the economy . . . it's an upward spiral. Economists call this a "multiplying factor," and say that each dollar spent has the economic impact of at least three dollars, and as many as seven dollars.

And by the way, when illegals wire their wages home, the economic LOSS is also between three and seven dollars for every dollar they send out of the country. CNN reported that in 2005 illegal migrants sent $20 billion dollars back to Mexico. And that's just one country. The total economic impact in the U.S. from this lost spending is between $100 and $300 billion dollars, per year.

Now a few thoughts for directdemocracy, who lays out four decades of harmful U.S. foreign policy in Latin America, and then stumbles to the irrational conclusion that it somehow justifies a harmful U.S. domestic policy. To twisted moralists like directdemocracy, the imperialist policies of the American ruling class—which enrich the ruling class, but cost working class Americans the lives of their sons and daughters in imperialist wars—should now be atoned for by corporate insourcing, which further enriches the ruling class and further costs the working class. We've already given our blood. Now you would have us give our jobs, our families' well being, and our last shred of dignity.

"No one is illegal" is nonsensical. Actions are illegal.

I'm coming to this discussion very late, but I've just read all the posts and want to say I truly appreciate the thoughtful and informed comments about corporate insourcing of low-wage replacement workers. (Let's call it what it is.)

This is especially heartening because CommonDreams readers are most likely progressives, yet a lopsided majority strongly oppose corporate insourcing. I hope all you good progressives will be contacting both Mother Jones (backtalk@motherjones.com) and your Congress members (http://www.house.gov/house/MemberWWW_by_State.shtml and http://www.senate.gov/pagelayout/senators/f_two_sections_with_teasers/states.htm), and telling them you're against corporate insourcing and amnesty. It's a shame that so many Republican-lite Democratic politicians and even so-called "progressive" Democratic politicians are kissing corporate ass. Even worse, as AdeleTheCzech has said, "Now even Mother Jones is selling out low-income working families!"

Thank you AdeleTheCzech for pointing out that Mother Jones' claim that "these 12 million undocumented workers . . . are vital to the profits of American agribusiness," is "the same snake oil Corporate America keeps spewing. We're supposed to care about the profits of AGRIBUSINESS?"

Thank you Yellow Horse, for saying "I would prefer to pay more for my lettuce, and chicken breasts, and avoid cheating some fellow American out of a decent living."

Thank you JerryfromTijuana, for adding that "If the immigrants left . . . whatever [extra] you pay for the lettuce will be more than offset by what you are no longer paying for schools, emergency rooms, incarceration, and all the myriad other costs illegal immigration imposes on the economy."

Thank you wdmax3, for saying "Take away the immigrant worker (illegal or not) and farmers will be forced to innovate and improve," and "nannies, janitors, restaurant workers and other unskilled jobs will be done by the same unskilled American workers that used to do them."

Thank you JerryfromTijuana for reminding us that (if the illegals left) "unskilled American Citizens might find a way to use a job like a unionized janitor gig to climb into the middle class. Like they once were able to do."

Thank you phelicks for sharing this truth: "The farmers in my area will not hire Americans . . . Instead they tell our kids who are fresh out of school that they're overqualified to do the work, or they already have enough workers." And why? "Their #1 fear they claim is the potential of union organization."

And phelicks adds "none of them are paying any income, SS or medicare tax on their wages and the farmers are not paying into the unemployment system either."

Thank you again JerryfromTijuana for telling Dixie, that her "most Anglos are not accustomed to working in this heat" rationalization is "almost an exact paraphrase of the original justifications in the 17th Century for bringing African slaves to Virginia," and for pointing out that "illegal Mexicans . . . coming from the highlands of Oaxaca, Chiapas, or the central area around Mexico City," are also not used to the heat.

Thank you randall_burns for telling Dixie "I'm really not willing to accept the problems associated with mass immigration just so you can hire yard workers at $15/hour instead of $30/hour."

Thank you Dan Dorn, for reminding us that the low-wage replacement workers are not just lettuce pickers and construction workers: "Is it fair for an American to invest thousands of dollars and years of time and hard work to prepare for a career that will not be there, because it has been given to a foreign worker here on a visa who will accept lower wages? This is exactly what happened in The Information Technology field."

And thank you again, Dan, for this simple truth: "The fight is not against immigrants at all, it is against the manipulation of the American labor supply by big business and our government . . . It is about Americans protecting their right to work and support their families."

Thank you again JerryfromTijuana for this first-hand observation of life in Mexico's villages: "There is nothing more disheartening than driving through a village in Zacatecas or Michoacan where NO ONE works, VERY FEW men are about, and everybody waits for the money transfers to hit each week."

Thank you matthood for this insight: "Allowing 13 millions illegals to stay in America because of the deliberate incompetence of our officials—and allowing corporate america to destroy labor by bribing congress—is fascism by default."

Thank you again Yellow Horse for suggesting we "make it a felony to hire someone who does not have the proper ID."

Yellow Horse's suggestion leads me to my own comments. As I've said before in another thread (http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/08/1044/) and elsewhere, the solution to corporate insourcing of low-wage replacement workers is to fine and jail the criminal employers, and stop providing public benefits to the illegal migrants. If an employer claims "we didn't know" our 3,000 non-English speaking workers on the factory floor were illegal, that employer should get the same consideration a motorist gets when he tells a highway patrol officer he "didn't know" he was speeding.

You start with the largest criminal corporations, and work your way down to the smaller employers, and then finally to the individuals employing illegal migrant gardeners, etc. Of course the fines and criminal penalties have to be harsh enough to change these criminal employers' behavior. As a bonus, the fines will more than pay for the costs of enforcement.

Do that, and criminal employers across the country will get the message and begin terminating their illegal employees. With no jobs and no public benefits, the illegals will voluntarily return home (where they can live well on the U.S. dollars they've accumulated). We don't need to deport anybody. Let them pay their own travel costs. They can drive across the border in daylight, safely and without fear, and stay together in whatever groups or families they choose.

My solution works, doesn't cost taxpayers anything, doesn't require militarizing the border, treats the low-wage replacement workers humanely, and puts the blame where it belongs: on the criminal corporations and other criminal employers.

Of course, under-employed and underpaid American workers will rejoice, including blue-collar workers, teen job seekers and college students trying to earn their way through college. But so will the honest employers who have been forced to compete with criminal competitors and their wage slaves.

All of these employers will have to compete for employees in a smaller pool of available workers, which means they will have to offer better wages and benefits. Among the many positive consequences, working moms who would rather stay home and raise their children will once again have that option when one income is enough to support a family—as it used to be in the decades before corporate insourcing.

The argument that prices will rise because wages rise is mostly false. It's the same argument Republicans make whenever someone suggests raising the minimum wage. The studies have shown that raising wages for low-wage earners does not correlate to higher prices. In fact, there is a net positive effect on the overall economy. It's called the "trickle-up" theory, and it's the opposite of the now discredited "trickle-down" theory first popularized by Ronald Reagan.

The trickle-up theory says that when low-wage earners make more, they spend it immediately—on food, shelter, clothing, etc. This new spending circulates in the local economy, boosting many businesses and their related suppliers, and ultimately causing them to spend more money on expansions and new employees, and then THAT new spending circulates in the economy . . . it's an upward spiral. Economists call this a "multiplying factor," and say that each dollar spent has the economic impact of at least three dollars, and as many as seven dollars.

And by the way, when illegals wire their wages home, the economic LOSS is also between three and seven dollars for every dollar they send out of the country. CNN reported that in 2005 illegal migrants sent $20 billion dollars back to Mexico. And that's just one country. The total economic impact in the U.S. from this lost spending is between $100 and $300 billion dollars, per year.

Now a few thoughts for directdemocracy, who lays out four decades of harmful U.S. foreign policy in Latin America, and then stumbles to the irrational conclusion that it somehow justifies a harmful U.S. domestic policy. To twisted moralists like directdemocracy, the imperialist policies of the American ruling class—which enrich the ruling class, but cost working class Americans the lives of their sons and daughters in imperialist wars—should now be atoned for by corporate insourcing, which further enriches the ruling class and further costs the working class. We've already given our blood. Now you would have us give our jobs, our families' well being, and our last shred of dignity.

"No one is illegal" is nonsensical. Actions are illegal.

hbramanti,

'Obey the law'

I'm curious what you think about my earlier post above in which I lay out some of the US actions inside Latin America over the past couple of decades.

In the name of 'fighting communism', 'the war on drugs' and now 'the war on terror' the US government has armed military dictatorships, staged coups, scorched the earth, and now through its 'do what I say not what I do' trade and economic 'development' programs in Latin America (e.g. Mexico must stop subsidizing its small farmers whereas the US will continue to subsidize agribusiness) the US has written and rewritten 'the law'.

What is the context within which migration takes place is not 'confusion' nor 'irrelevant'. We must, as much as possible, seek to clearly understand social, economic and political relationships if we are to create meaningful and positive change.

!Nadie es ilegal!

The confusion seems to continue, please differentiate between immigrants and ilegal immigrants. We have immigration laws and those that follow the law should be and are welcomed into the USA and can then become citizens as I did many years ago. The ilegal so called immigrants should be sent back to their country of origin period. To legalize millons of them is obsene. This was done before "for the last time" during Carter's administration, remember. Not again. That business needs them and so on is irrelevant, obey the law. HRB

Unbridled illegal immigration undermines the country in many ways. A country does not have open borders for good reasons. It breeds anarchy. The libertarian mind set divides what can be called a country. Why should a country have good roads, good schools, clean and safe environment for healthy living, thriving economy for all of its members? Why? The anarchist and libertarian want no rules, no conventions. Unfortunately in a country of 300 million people, any cohesive society for that matter, there has to be agreed upon conventions, rules, laws or it is the rule of the jungle. It was that way even in the prehistoric cave. A large number of the current population does not have the mind of the savages (although it does exist today among the very provincial and the unevolved). Those who exploit the underprivileged in reality are savages regardless of what education they may have.

The fact is that people immigrate because conditions where they live are unbearable or a good life is unattainable. If we look at the countries from where most of the illegal immigrants are coming from (and it appears that the USA is only focusing on south of the border countries), it is obvious that the immigrants' own countries are doing nothing to help their own citizens. Why is that? It is not that these countries are poor, they just have poor people kept poor by their own governments, the officials of which are not poor. These countries have very very rich people that do nothing to help their countrymen have a decent life. They have no proper taxes or programs that take care of even the basic needs of their people. They are exceedingly corrupt.

Now it is said this country of the USA cannot do without the work force that comes from illegal immigrants. That is really insane. Why do we not have an adequate work force? Mainly because a certain portion of the population always wants things for free or at very little cost. It is the money, honey. And it is the corporations that want most of it. They don't want to pay decent wages or provide even ordinary benefits. Just think about sweat shops and back-breaking field work.

But also think of the consequences for the general public of America of allowing anmesty for millions of illegal immigrants. First of all, these are really ignorant people, good workers they may be but they are really ignorant of the history of this country, they don't want to adopt the language of the country, or obey the laws, at any rate, they immediately become an electoral force. Look at the effect in those cities who were trying to curb the effects of illegal immigrants on their cities and the political control exercised by illegal immigrants! They will reap all the benefits of the taxes paid by Americans without having paid much themselves. I know many of them said they pay taxes, but how many have not? How many other benefits American enjoy will they then have access to without having been in a legal work force. Labor unions will become controlled, schools will become crowded, it is unending what will become affected.

There should be an immigration policy that does allow people to come into the country. Diverse peoples bring wonderful benefits. That is one of the founding premises of this country. But historically there have been quotas based on certain criteria and there should be now. There has to be conditions that these immigrants become Americans, that is, learn the language, learn the laws, learn its history. That is what naturalization is all about. They should have access to everything any American has. But the millions being proposed to give blanket amnesty to right now, is simply wrong for the benefit of this country. A worker program ought to be created to allow both the people needing jobs and an income and the companies that need workers to man their companies. But the worker program should not have anything to do with immigration. Immigration is a separate issue and these workers would be under the same quota conditions as any other immigrants from any country. It seems that the proposed immigration policy right now is directed at only the Hispanic illegal immigrants, but wouldn't any policy cover any illegal immigrant from any country?

Immigration - An American Middle Class Point Of View

It is not about immigration, it is about keeping jobs and feeding our families.

Of course Americans would like to see new immigrants come to this country - it is what makes it rich and diverse, BUT right now, we simply CANNOT AFFORD it, at least for the time being.

We have a debt crisis mounting in this country that is being fueled by a SURPLUS OF LABOR, especially in some professions. Add the labor surplus to the fact that many American jobs are being offshored, and hopefully you will understand that this is not about Americans being unfriendly toward immigrants. It is about Americans protecting their right to work and support their family.

An example, a recent article in my town paper stated that there are 60 houses in FORECLOSURE in my town. A leading credit counseling agency in my state said that the one main reason for people seeking credit counseling is JOB LOSS! there were other reasons, of course, but JOB LOSS was the biggest reason.

The fight is not against immigrants at all, it is against the manipulation of the American labor supply by big business and our government. Current immigration and foreign worker visa legislation and practices provide industry with cheap labor, and take a huge toll on the lives of middle class Americans.

I am predicting that, although much effort is made to distract Americans away from this issue (poor reporting by the mainstream media - even PBS (that is sad)!) it will become the major issue again. Remember the slogan "Its the economy, stupid" from the Clinton campaign of 1992? The true sentiment there was "Its about living wage jobs, stupid." From a middle class American point of view, that is the meaning.

A healthy stock market no longer equates to good paying jobs for the middle class. Economic hardship is being reported locally all over the country, especially where it has hit hardest, and Americans are becoming more aware that. Even though we keep hearing about a good economy (the stock market might be doing good and corporate CEOs are making the biggest salaries ever), real wages for middle class Americans continue to decline, the continues to widen, Americans are long term unemployed, underemployed. We are in a debt crisis and there is no job security.

On a personal level, consider this - is it fair for an American to invest thousands of dollars and years of time and hard work to prepare for a career that will not be there, because it has been given to a foreign worker here on a visa who will accept lower wages? Especially when they are advised by their own labor department that there will be much job growth…. Now maybe you understand the frustration.

And,…Is it fair that, a mid career professional (even one being paid starting salary for their field) gets laid off because wages for that occupation all of the sudden decrease by 10-15% (or more) as a direct result of flooding that specific job market with foreign workers here on a work visa? This displaced high tech worker now cannot get another job (even for less money) because of the wage differential they would be regarded by industry as undesirable - a disgruntled employee. This is exactly what happened in The Information Technology field.

This is JUST A PREVIEW of what is to come in many service occupations that make use of technology.

So, maybe now you can understand that Americans are not against immigration in general. The job situation in America has changed, and we cannot afford immigration that threatens an Americans ability to pay the mortgage and feed the family.

They "fight our wars?" Who are you trying to kid. In fact, "undocumented" immigrants are not allowed to join the military, period. You have to be legal to do so; and everybody I know who opposes illegal immigration is equally opposed to allowing them to enlist.

As for them "growing our food": are you aware that the US agriculture industry is massively subsidized by the American taxpayer? Not only did we have that $190 farm subsidy bill passed 5 years ago, but that the ag industry in the West continues to get massive subsidies in the form of cheap water.

I do (ever so vaguely) seem to recall a nation being here (and doing quite well) before the modern immigration tsunami began.

Hi MichaelPDA: I took your advice and went onto the Progressive Democrats site. Unfortunately, I couldn't find a word on where they stand regarding illegal immigration. Since I agreed with their positions on other issues, I want to join the PDA -- if they're taking the side of poor and lower-middle-class working people on immigration. Can you help me out here? Thanks!

Adele

Our elected officials want amnesty for allowing 13 millons illegals to come into america unchallenged. They dont understand the rule of law. Allowing 13 millions illegals to stay in America because of the deliberate incompetence of our officals is fascism by default. The 46 million americans without heath insurance is the direct result of big business's war against labor. The RIGHT TO WORK LAW has allowed corporate america to destroy labor by bribing congress to ignore our immigration laws. Hitler would be proud of Wall Street who is keeping facism alive through illegal immigration. Its about justice for our own. If you can not take care of americas people, how dare congress care about others. Congress is a godless nation like Sodom and Gomorrah. No absolution for congress. They must redeem themseves for their economic treason! Force congress to deport them all. It was Congress who let them in!

hey randall burns - just so you know - NO one in my SW town has a lawn. It's too hot and it's not waterwise. It would be absurd to have a lawn. We do have plants though; ones hardy enough to stand the heat and of course we have weeds. I do a lot of the weeding, but now that I'm in my 70s I need some help occasionally. Hope that answers your question.

Direct Democracy: Great outline. I had forgotten how massive the numbers, but a few years back Harper's did a story on what's actually happened to Nicaraqua and how many of the young men who came to the US ended up in prison, etc. leading to a spiral of despair so pervasive the entire nation has been impacted by it. Add that to the Iraq numbers, Vietnam numbers, etc. People try to migrate away from terror and war... the US leaders have caused so much misery around the globe. Every time the US gets a tornado or hurricane or drought I feel it' s the beginning of karma's return. A nation cannot act this way when it was given SO much relative to other lands, and yet it's CEO-merchant caste designs ways to beguile goods and services from the most needy. This profit thing is an ugly disease. Just for metaphor, consider, US birthday, July 4 makes it a CANCER nation (Bush is also a Cancer), and like a disease it's been devouring the world's resources, rendering the entire planet (ecosystem by ecosystem) sick. The great mother is left in land mines, dead zones around coastal regions, burned forests, depleted fisheries, mined or blasted mountains like amputated breasts, depleted uranium and agent orange hung from the foliage when not biologically now embedded... and on and on. What the "righteous" have done to Eden.

"Not only do these undocumented immigrants fight our wars, grow our food, care for our children and elderly, and serve us in a hundred ways every day, but they have also become an integral cog in American economic growth."

Why should anyone come here just to do low-paying work that Americans are too prissy to do themselves? Especially when they wouldn't be so prissy about it if they were paid well to do it.

"I then want to see their faces the next time they hit the local supermarket to buy food (not just fruit and vegetables but chicken and about anything else) - ha, and they thought gas prices was cutting into their budget!"

But would it have to be that way? Why should Mexicans come here to work for peanuts so as to increase profit margins?

If I were Mexican, I wouldn't want to go through all that trouble to come here just to be less poor. Things must be bad in Mexico.

This whole issue is such a mess, and what's really sad about it, it that it could be fixed sans fences, criminalization, and mass deportation. We just need to go after the right people (ahem...big business) and force our nation to start investing in her own people rather than exploiting foreigners.

Illegal immigration really only benefits the wealthy and powerful.

Dixie, I used to work construction in the summer in Missouri which is often just as hot as Arizona-and more humid. I'm sorry the idiots running construction crews there don't have enough sense to put out lights and do the work at night-which is what we'd do in Missouri.

I'm really not willing to accept the problems associate with mass immigration just so you can hire yard workers at $15/hour instead of $30/hour-and the fed can continue massive foreign borrowing. Frankly, I think manicured lawns are a highly overrated luxury.

The thing is, we have clear examples of countries with no massive foreign borrowing, no mass immigration, high levels of income equality and highly productive economies.

In answer to the query above from Jerry from Tiajuana, 30 years ago my SW town had only about 1000 people, only one motel, and less than a handful of restaurants; today it has 20 to 25,000 people (and millions of tourists) and countless hotels and restaurants. 30 years ago very few people had ever heard of this town, today it is a world famous resort area that is madly growing. Illegals here are not paid $4 an hour to dig ditches, they are paid $9 and some of the more skilled workers are paid more. People who clean hotels are paid $8 to start and get raises. Most of my friends are paid $10 to $15 an hour in construction, restaurant or yard work. The fact is that most Anglos are not accustomed to working in this heat. I know several young anglo men who came here and got work in construction and only lasted through the winter, by June they couldn't take the heat and went back to Illinois and Boston. You could double the wages people get here and maybe find legal workers. That would make their salaries $20 to $30 an hour. Contruction costs would be even higher than the astronomical costs they are now, and hotel and restaurant bills would be beyond the price of only the most affluent. Maybe that's a good thing. I'll let you sort it out.
p.s. I'm not ashamed that I hire a very capable illegal to do yard work once a month at $15 and hour.

Adele, the Czech,

If I may, forget the DLC. That group of Dems are completely in the pocket of the corporations. Their need to triangulate is strangulation progessive policies everywhere. Just look at the war they just took ownership of.

Better to contact the members of the Congressional Progressive Caucus and let them know the bill is tantamount to a corporate institutionalizing of indentured servitude.

http://cpc.lee.house.gov/

Last I heard, 8 members of the CPC are backing the bill. We cannot have that, and we need to pressure them to stand together as a group and not enslave a population.

This is the group we must support, expand, and work with to stay together. They are the largest caucus in the House, and though they do not always stand together on the issues, if enough of their constituents and citizens all over the country know that we progressives have their backs, well then they will grow stronger.

PDA is working with the caucus and working to expand it. Donate to PDA and they will work hard to see that progressives get elected. Check out this link and see two candidates PDA is backing to be the Dem candidates. They have made a stand on the issues that we believe in, and we should help grow the progrssive base in Congress. It is our best hope:

http://pdamerica.org/articles/campaigns/2007-05-25-17-43-35-campaigns.php

I do hope that somebody from the Democratic "Leadership" Council (which needs some major course corrections) reads these comments. Common Dreams is a Progressive, left-wing site -- and the DLC should be pretty shocked at our lack of support for legalizing 12 million uninvited workers.

Notice there are no racist rants (except for Lou2007, who's set up that straw man and knocked it over). What's more, there's a brilliant timeline by directdemocracy outlining the years of U.S. depredations south of the border, which explains why we're besieged by millions of poor people at a time when working class Americans are in desperate economic shape.

Adele

kitty_tc wrote
"Here's a solution: annex Mexico.
.....
Do that with Canada too and welcome to your new progressive majority continent. Though, all things considered, it'd probably be better if they annexed us."

Goodbye reproductive rights, hello massive corruption.

The closest thing we've seen to a success like that in recent years was the EU expansion-which took a massive investments to pull off reasonably. Something like this isn't going to work unless most people in both the US and Mexico (and for that matter Canada) want it.

I actually support significant improvement of infrastructure in Mexico. I would also spring for a poverty alleviation program there. However, the economic and political gap between the US and Mexico is big-far bigger than any of the EU countries. I really think we are a long ways from something like this making political or economic sense.

Kitty, I think you have hit the nail on the head. We need a second Mexican/American war. We shouldn't have stopped the the Rio Grande in the last one. If we hadn't had such a paucity of grand design in our imperial aspirations in the past we may have solved this problem back in 1848.

Does Mexico possess Weapons of Mass Destruction? On second thought, no need to answer that. We'll fix the policy around it anyway.

Here's a solution: annex Mexico.

You think I'm kidding, but why not? Their government is screwed, their economy worse, so if they're going to come here anyhow might as well give them all citizenship, the vote, minimum wage protections, and all the other benefits of being part of the US. And then nobody can bitch about them being here, because they'd be officially Americans and allowed to go where they please. No more border. No more arbitrary distinction between "them" and "us" because they're us now too.

Do that with Canada too and welcome to your new progressive majority continent. Though, all things considered, it'd probably be better if they annexed us.

In the end, these people are coming here the same reason anyone else ever came here. They want to better their lives, feed their families, have some diginified way to live. I don't think setting up a system where we have citizens and an indentured class represents an America that I believe reaches to the highest principles upon which it was founded (leaving the matter of what we did to the indigenous people and our slave policy aside in regard to founding principles).

Much of our foreign policy thrust, such as NAFTA adn CAFTA, are at fault. Why can we subsidize American corn farmers, but NAFTA says that Mexico is not allowed to subsidize its corn growers? The Mexican farmers end up being unable to compete, leave the farm, migrate to the cities, with many ending up coming here. How you can blame someone for wanting to eat, to care for their families? We have to see that it is the "systems" we have in place that create much of our problems. It is all a kind of dependent origination thing going on, cause and effect.

I have to say, it is somewhat ironic that after creating false reasons for invading Mexico and stealing much of the southwestern part of what is now the United States from them, we are getting what we deserve. If you have this, then you get that, just as the wheel of the cart naturally follows the hoof of the oxen. And just as the foot of the imigrant follows the path to what they hope is a better life.

All distinctions based on culture, race, believes fall away when one begins to see our likenesses more than our superficial, nonsubstantial differences.

What happened to the full time job? Every company wants to hire part-time so they do not have to pay benefits. A lot of jobs are still going begging. Illegals want the easiest job they can find too. The only way people can get ahead financially is if they work off of the books.
Anyone who thinks illegals are not lowering wages is living in the dark ages. If they are administrators or professionals eventually their wages will be lowered. Money has to come from somewhere.
Our elected officals support this rampage of people coming over here because they dispise labor and the real costs are taken care of at the state level.
I worked at a tourist resort and they hired all kinds of illegals. The ones who did not work hard were sent home.
A majority of these illegals are sponsored by businesses looking to save a buck.

The farmers in my area will not hire Americans. Their #1 fear they claim is the potential of union organization. So, instead they tell our kids who are fresh out of school that they're over qualified to do the work or they already have enough workers. And those workers, we've discovered, are here illegally. All of them. Our complaints made to the authorities have had no effect on this practice either. They seem to have a good ole boy network going with the authorities.
There really isn't much other work to do in our rural area and these kids would have to drive over 30 miles one way to the nearest town center to find jobs that pay little more than what these illegals are making. Not to mention the fact that none of them are paying any income, SS or medicare tax on their wages and the farmers are not paying into the unemployment system either.
And to you who complain how WalMarts are destroying local economies, this is even worse.
I do not have a problem with these people if they come here legally. But it's been way too easy for them to come in here and scoop up all the jobs and rental properties, that it's more like a plague of locusts has descended on our way of life here.

directdemocracy, good post.

One of the most pitifully sad matters that has come out of the recent debates over immigration is, once again, the poverty of our political discourse in Washington. Rarely, if ever, has a Washington insider, over the past couple years of intensified debate on immigration, uttered a compelling analysis of the immigration issue.

Here's a couple of examples of what is missing in terms of a holistic analysis of the immigration puzzle:

1970s and 1980s--250,000 Guatemalans are killed during a brutal war that is considered genocide against the Mayan indigenous. The US funds the Guatemalan military that tortures and wages the genocidal campaign. Hundreds of thousands are displaced, land is scorched, families torn apart and many migrate north to the very country that fueled the military campaign forcing them to migrate in the first place.

1980s--30,000 Nicaraguans are left dead after the illegally US backed Contras wage war on the Sandanistas who have just overthrown a dictatorship of the Somoza family that lasted 3 generations and enjoyed good business relations with many US corporations and US government officials. Many thousands are displaced and the eventual defeat of the Sandanistas creates increased flows of migration to the US with the hopes of many progressive reforms in education, health, and farming now vanishing.

1980s-70,000 El Salvadorans killed in a bloody Civil War in which the US government backed a brutal military dictatorship, which esssentially represented the largest landownders in the country who owned roughly 80% of all land. Despite widespread and well reported human rights abuses throughout the civil war the US continues funneling money to the military who had direct links with paramilitaries that commit the majority of murders. US officials are on the ground in prison cells, seen in torture chambers, and experiment with what would be called the 'El Salvador model' later invoked by some of the same thugs who run the II Iraq war as a term to mean--form paramilitary troops to operate outside the law in order to 'get er done'.

1990s--1.5 million small farmers are displaced from the land in Southern Mexico after the Mexican government, with no popular support amongst the masses, signs onto NAFTA and thus has to privatize landholdings, slash government support for small farmers and agriculture, and open the doors to foreign takeover of land. Some of the farmers refuse to give in to the land reform and are, still to this day, at war with local paramilitary and military groups all over Southern Mexico as they attempt to hold on to their land. The US government pushes NAFTA hard, arms the Mexican military as well, and in its own backyard subsidizes corporate agribusiness that dumps corn on Mexican markets making life miserable for those small farmers who are able to maintain their land as corn prices drop in Mexico. Millions leave home and head north to the border to find jobs in sweatshops, also part of NAFTA. Sweatshops close as jobs are cheaper in China and Southeast Asia and workers cross the border now lacking a piece of land and a job.

1990s to present--Latin America undergoes, alongside some of the above examples of which there are more, major economic reforms known as neoliberalism--which means governments no longer are meant to reallocate resources or provide social services and social goods rather they should create good business environments and open their doors to free trade, foreign capital, and multinational corporations whose work in their countries will eventually 'trickle down' and all will benefit. This after (and even during) the US funds dictatorships and corrupt militaries during the Cold War whose social networks and allies tend to be in the best positions to benefit from said 'neoliberalism'...

So, what is my point?

That the United States government and private interests is and has been one of the greatest push factors (promoting war, violence, economic imperialism, resource wars, unstable economic programs) of migration as well as a pull factors (offering domestic jobs, dollars, and willing employers). Until the people of this country are willing to look squarely at the reality that 80% of the world's resources flow to a mere (and shrinking) 20% of the world's population we will continue to adequately grasp why there is so much immigration.

Migrants are following their own resources and related economies to the belly of the beast. In order to reform US immigration policy we need to transform the entire global economy, US foreign policy, and be willing to look at the long history of US imperialism in Latin America.

!No one is illegal!

I live in a SW community. Because it is very scenic it is a tourist area and the entire economy is based on tourism - hotels, motels, condos, restaurants and the accompanying gift stores and art galleries. We are only a few hours from the mexican border. All the actual work in my town is done by illegals mailnly from Mexico. They clean the rooms,bathrooms, do the laundry, fix the "free" breakfast, do the drycleaning, prepare and cook all the food in ALL the restaurants (not just mexican food); they dig the ditches for the sewers for the constant building of more hotels and condos, they do the roofing and the majority of the construction. They do the landscaping and the yard maintenance of all the hotels, restaurants, and the private homes of the residents.
The temperature in the SW becomes excessive for 6 months of the year to do work out side. (Try digging sewer lines for 8 hours a day in 110 to 115 degree heat, or try roofing in the same temperature - the heat is even more intense on the roofs, you might prefer drywalling or carpentry even though there is no air conditioning while the building is going up). People who say that others will take these jobs haven't lived here and simply don't know what they are talking about. I might add that the illegals are not taking any citizens' jobs. My local paper which comes out twice a week has had 3 pages of help wanted ads EVERY week for the past year (that's when I started checking just to see if jobs were scarce).
I happen to know a lot of these illegal Mexicans because I have volunteered to teach english as a second language. They come to the center once a week for two hours, after a long hard day working, just to learn. There are more applicants than teachers. They WANT to learn english. Most of the people here have been working in my town for 8 to 15 years. They have put down roots; they only want to be legal and to be part of this country. They are here because they could not find work in Mexico (which is largly due to the NAFTA pact that put millions of farmers out of business and caused a depression throughout the country.)
Virtually every illegal in my town is hired by an American business and thus both state and federal social security, workmans comp and unemployment is deducted from their paycheck. They know they will never see a dime of it. Many of the illegals also pay income tax. When all of them are sent back to Mexico I wonder what will happen to the MILLIONS(or more likely BILLIONS) of FREE dollars they have been putting into social security?
If INS raided my town and sent back every illegal the entire town would close down. Hotels could not run, restaurants would have no one to fix the food, construction would come to a halt.
But that is just the tip of the iceberg. If all these people left we would have hundreds or maybe thousands of houses and apartments that are now rented standing empty.(Imagine the effect on housing prices) Also the grocery stores and other stores would miss the millions of dollars they annually spend in this community. Multiply that in communities all across the country and you milght well have an economic disaster.
Speaking of disasters, this immigration bill is one. The guest worker program is a program that at best is a bad form of serfdom and at worst is a form of slavery. the "guests" cannot change employers if the employer cheats him or fails to pay him what was agreed. There are already many known cases of this and this bill would foster many more.
The bill regarding citizenship for illegals says that the head of the household must go back to Mexico to start the process of legal immigration, but he will go to the back of the line behind any Mexicans who did not come here illegally and have applied (several million of them). This is a farce. No one I know is going to do that. They are not going to go back and wait 8 or 10 years while this process goes forward and their wives and children are in America (as this bill apparently allows). What is more, they are not allowed to come visit their family if they should go back and their family cannot go to visit them or they forfeit their right to stay here. I repeat NO ONE who has been here 8 - 15 years is going to do this! They are quite willing to pay the fine - I know several families who are now busily saving money to pay the $5000 fine, but they are NOT going back. Tell congress to rethink this. It will accomplish nothing and we will still have a mess on our hands.

Just a thought _ who's going to do all the dirty work once these poor people are sent packing .

I can't see too many white Americans getting off their beaches and off their surfboards -to clean stinking toilets or pick fruit off millions of acres of California orchards often in the blazing hot sun.

Oh and how about the rich and the famous - living in their plush mansions and penthouses . Snorting designer coke ,mainlining - and partying ,frenziedly ,till the break of dawn.

One's heart bleeds for them -having ,from now on, to pay top dollar for domestic help and nanny services .that too after years of paying a pittance to some undocumented 'alien' .

Or else ,running the terrible, unconscionable risk of getting their own lily -white hands dirty -doing an ' honest 'day's work for a change.( Ohhh...shudder).

People are cattle and we need fences to keep those from the Mexican ranch wandering around and getting mixed up with the mindless beasts that belong to Rancho America.

For disease control too, as Lou Dobbs has so thoughtfully pointed out. Some of the wandering, runaway cattle are bringing leprosy and AIDS and other diseases to the clean and healthy cattle in America.

All the cattle should be branded so they can be returned to their owners.

Cattle that runaway 2 or 3 times must be punished so that they learn to stay on their own ranch and not wander around as if they were FREE HUMAN BEINGS going where they choose to go.

Cattle can be used for 6 years in a guest cattle program. The mindless beasts need not be near their families and cannot organize or complain.

Mooooo I say. MOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Take all these plans that deny dignity and respect to fellow human beings and shove them up your stinking, big, elite rear ends you filthy, despicable bigots.

Will I calm down enough again and not hit the submit comment button? Fuck it!

You know, I live in a part of the country that is HEAVILY effected by immigration and these people are freaking out!
And, all I can think of lately is, was this what it was like at Plymouth Rock for the Indians? I mean, hell, they must have said 'What are we gonna do about these people that just keep coming?'
Well, they didn't think of a plan, now they are as good as dead.
Seems like the wheel has come back around.
Except this time, we're out of Indians.
So guess who's next? I don't see anybody coming up with a plan that STOPS it so, deja vue, any one?

If you don't want immigrants befouling our nest, don't befoul theirs.

As far as immigrants "paying their way".

Current US taxes don't really pay for US governmental expenditures. The US government borrows heavily every year-and has for quite a while now. When you look at the countries that have high social services and are paying their way, they typically have much lower levels of immigration-and a different selection process than the US does. Canada has a higher immigration level than the US-and high social services ---but Canada's selection criteria is VERY different than that of the US. I don't think Canada's criteria are ideal-but they are better than the US criteria.

Maintenance of a state with high social services is a very tricky thing-and high levels of immigration stresses that ability. Importing unskilled-largely minimally literate labor is just not a good move in the current world economy. If this path continues, the US economy will continue the degeneration it has experienced since 1972-and the adjustment when it comes will get harder.

JerryfromTijuana, I beg to differ with you. Immigrants pay taxes every time they buy something so I think they pay their way when it comes to social services they use. Secondly I think your way off base in thinking the savings from social services would off set the increased cost of just about every thing we eat at home or eating out.
I have traveled all over southern Mexico and the highlands and while it is true that many of the villages have no young men as they have left to work in the U.S. I saw no one sitting on their butts waiting for the money to roll in. These people work hard to make to put food on the table even with the money that some of them get from the States. Thousands of little plots of corn, food vendors alongside the road for 12 to 15 hours a day. I guess they could get into helping the drug pipeline into the States which is what many of the ones that stay end up doing.

One error in Ridgeway's article:

There will still be plenty of children to educate. There is nothing preventing a married couple from both coming as guest workers-and if a guest worker delivers a child on US soil, that child is by current law a citizen. For that matter, even if a spouse is still in Mexico and can't get a job, their guest worker spouse could faciliate their coming to the US just in time to deliver a child that would be a US citizen.

Visitor visas are still fairly easy to get-and the measures proposed aren't going to really close the border firmly. I know an obstetric nurse who was in California and saw women that were there explicitly to deliver a child that would be a US citizen(these women were largely from either Mexico or the far east-the latter were arriving on tourist visas).

Now even Mother Jones is selling out low-income working families! These words, "...we couldn't survive a day without them. These 12 million undocumented workers, who are for the most part employed, are only filling an obvious need. They are vital to the profits of American agribusiness (which also stands to be a primary beneficiary of the guest worker program) and form the backbone of the low-cost workforce in the service industries..." is the same snake oil Corporate America keeps spewing. We're supposed to care about the profits of AGRIBUSINESS?

And as to the service industries, I'll bet many readers here started their working lives (like I did) waiting tables, as bank tellers or store clerks, etc. -- either right out of high school or to help with college tuition. Where are today's teens supposed to get work experience? (Unless you think hanging out at the mall with your own credit card and cellphone is a character-building experience.)

I'd also like to know how many Americans and legal immigrants are actually out of work. The government's statistics are a laugh; once your unemployment insurance runs out, you drop off their radar screen. I know among African-Americans it's over 10%, but that's because black groups care about this and make sure to get the real numbers.

Now that Mother Jones has joined so-called populists John Edwards and Dennis Kucinich on the wrong side of the illegal immigration debate, it's time for a Working Families Party (oops, sorry, we have one here in NY State, and they're on the wrong side too). Clearly we need a new party that represents the average Joe and Jane.

James Ridgeway shows some fundamental ignorance of the immigration issue. He claims that immigrants are "essential" to the American economy. However, it is clear that we have examples like Korea and Japan that lack America's natural resources, have virtually no net immigration, high levels of income equality and virtually no foreign borrowing have economies that are growing faster in productivity per worker than the US economy is.

I agree that current legislation is calculated to increase control over immigrants-it is also calculated to maintain control over US citizens and mine the economic value of citizenship. It isn't just illegal immigration that is a problem. One of the groups most impacted by immigration policy have been US tech workers-one of the most skilled -and unruly-groups.

I would suggest that mass immigration is no more esssential to the US economy than heroin is to addicts. Short run, withdrawal from Heroin is very painful-even debilitating. Long run, staying on heroin is deadly.

The US needs to move towards a substainable and sensible economy. Mass immigration-and massive foreign borrowing-helps prevent the US from doing that. Just as heroin maintains the illusion of freedom from pain in the presence of poor health, immigration maintains the illusion of growth when real productivity, investment in human capital and is falling-and the value of citizenship is endangered..

Withdrawing from immigration will be extremely painful to the wealthy interests that have supported mass immigration-and the social/political interests that have maintained power through mass immigration.

The US currently gets over 10 Million immigration applications each year-and accepts fewer than 1 Million. It isn't clear that the selection criteria here makes sense for either Americans or the source countries-but is largely motivated by wealthy and influential interests. We need a policy which makes the US a respected world citizen-and which is better for existing US citizens.

We need to look at the combination of factors that have taken the US towards this bad turn. It was a mistake to allow mass poverty to persist in North America-when with relatively modest steps much of it could have been eliminated. It was a mistake to allow the concentration of wealth that has been associated with mass immigration-and the attendent concentration of political power. Those mistakes can and should be corrected.

Rather than yet another expansion of immigration(as proposed by current legislation) or a mass, rapid deportation, I tend to favor an immigration policy that is immediately accompanied less net legal immigration than we have now(which is what most Americans want). Those immigrants that find it necessary to leave should be largely encouraged to leave by financial incentives-and disincentives. This could be initially funded in large part by collection of the $25,000 per violation for employers that is already on the book-and the proceeds used to provide resettlement allowances and improvement of infrastructure in major source countries of illegal immigration.

Long run, the wealthy in the US and Latin America have a huge mess they profitted from and need to be held accountable for fixing.

I have written extensively on the topic of immigration. Common Dreams readers can see my articles here. I would welcome contact with other Common Dreams readers. In particular, my article The Jobs Crunch was rejected by Mother Jones-and the issues it raises have never been adequately addressed.

I keep hearing that America would not be able to survive a day without low skilled immigrant workers. Basic economics would state otherwise because American workers would fill the positions once the working conditions and wages are improved. Improving working conditions is what we should be doing anyway. If we are using low skilled labor instead of improving wages and working conditions we are exploiting the workers.

America will find a way, capitalism makes certain of that, "American Exploitation" can be replaced by good old "American Ingenuity". Take away the immigrant worker (illegal or not) and farmers will be forced to innovate and improve, this is a good thing, no more exploitation. Nannies, janitors, restaurant workers and other unskilled jobs will be done by the same unskilled American workers that used to do them, again no more exploitation (most Americans won't stand for it, they will complain).

Laws are only as effective as the means to enforce them. New improved laws will not be enforced any more than the current laws on the books. How can we know that any reform will work if we do not have the ability to effectively enforce our current laws (evidence: 14 million illegal immigrants in the country now).

Solution is simple, fund and hire the necessary personnel and equipment to enforce the current laws. Begin enforcing the laws, collect data and make decisions based on the data and make policy changes when needed.

Having relatives who are Mexican Nationals I understand the desire to better one's self and offer one's family a better life.
---- So, "clean up your own back yard before you mess up our back yard."---------

I was in a small grocery store not long ago when a young man paid for his purchase with a counterfeit $20.00 bill. The clerk discovered it quite easily with the stroke of a pen. So why cannot the same care be given to ID cards for LEGAL ALIENS i.e. immigrants. (By the way I am of Native American and Immigrant extraction.) The simple answer is that big business benefits from cheap, easily exploited labor, and the "illegals" are able to send millions (collectively)every year to their families. Everybody but the American labor force benefits. I would prefer to pay more for my lettuce, and chicken breasts, and avoid cheating some fellow American out of a decent living and at the same time not participate in the exploitation of my fellow human being. To me there is NO QUESTION ABOUT IT. The ONLY reason people come here illegally is because they know they can find "work".

All of us would like to believe that we have "the solutions" to all of our problems. The truth is, the problems evolve along with the solutions, and it is a constant struggle. So, that's life.

It might be helpful to consider taking "big business" and other special interest groups out of the equation. This could only be done by changing the campaign financing laws.

It might be helpful to make it a felony to hire someone who does not have the proper ID.
I was born in Texas and am a Veteran so my ID could pass inspection by GOD.
So, here's a hint, if they don't speak ANY English, then they are a "new immigrant", and should have the proper ID, if they don't, then call INS because you'll go to jail if you hire them. If the USA wants immigrants, then the immigrants should be given every consideration, and exploitation is NO consideration it just makes the wealthy even wealthier. There could be no greater irony than to be wealthy and IN JAIL, and the wealthy or the exploiter would avoid it with vigor.

Human nature is exploitive, History will bear this out. However, humans were at one time scavengers who ran the predators away from their kills. Humanity overcame that (with exception to extreme conditions) so humanity is capable of overcoming the exploitation of our fellow human, but only if we all agree on that action, and work to promote it.

There is a distinct possibility that if enough humans agree on the proper actions all of the present problems could be resolved and we would be better prepared for the new problems that evolve.

There is also the distinct possibility that we could blow ourselves up and into extinction.

I'll work for the former possibility.

Yellow Horse

And for those who prove really valuable to their, er, employers, guess who will foot the $5000 for citizenship, then hold this new "debt" over said employee's head. Indentured servitude, anybody?

US military has accepted foreigners as soldiers in return for US citizenship. It's an all volunteer army and they are recruiting overseas.

As I always tell my conservative Mexiphobes-I wish it were possible for you to get your wish and all illegal aliens (which means Mexicans to them) were deported overnight and a wall fifty feet high built across the border with Mexico. I then want to see their faces the next time they hit the local supermarket to buy food (not just fruit and vegetables but chicken and about anything else) - ha, and they thought gas prices was cutting into their budget!

I agree -- but, I'm afraid I disagree. There's a band of us in California who disagree with this, most severely. We just want it to STOP!!

As a matter of fact, we're convinced that there is some money behind it all.

When will it STOP!!